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Author Topic: An alien ate your computer  (Read 4408 times)

worker201

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An alien ate your computer
« on: 27 July 2006, 19:57 »
My dad called today because his computer ate shit and died for reasons unknown.  Of course he uses Windows XP, for circular reasons, and he is unopen to other possibilities.  The symptoms of his problem are documented here:
http://support.microsoft.com/?kbid=315311

Now, as you can read on that page, the cause of the problem is:
Quote
This issue may occur if the Isapnp.sys file is damaged or is not present in the path that the error message specifies.

wtf?  How does a file become damaged?  The computer was shut down properly last night, it was carried home in a safe bag (it's a laptop), and it sat quietly powered down all night.  This morning, restart failed.  This is the kind of shit that makes Microsoft ridiculous.  I've never had a file mysteriously disappear in OSX or Linux.  But it seems to happen all the time in Windows.

Although I was able to prevent Genuine Advantage from being installed on his other 2 computers, this one may have slipped past me.  Wonder if that has anything to do with it?  Meh, I'm probably just paranoid.

Note: I am not asking for Windows tech support.  I know how to repair the problem, and recover data if the problem is not repairable.  And I know how to install a real OS.  I'm just letting people know that this sort of thing really does happen, and with no apparent cause.  It's not just FUD, this is documented sucking.

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pofnlice

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Re: An alien ate your computer
« Reply #1 on: 27 July 2006, 21:11 »
mAXIMUS SUCKIMUS DUDICUS!!!
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H_TeXMeX_H

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Re: An alien ate your computer
« Reply #2 on: 27 July 2006, 23:38 »
You should hesitate to fix it for him ... tell him "I'll fix it, but in the meantime check out this Ubuntu CD" ... ok, well, maybe it won't work. Or tell him what you said here, this shit don't happen on anything but Window$. If it doesn't work either nothing will work, I couldn't get anyone in my family to switch, Window$ is a part of them, removing it would be like removing a critical organ ....
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worker201

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Re: An alien ate your computer
« Reply #3 on: 28 July 2006, 00:57 »
It's hard to explain what makes an older guy (my dad is 66) stick with Windows.  Almost every daily function of OSX is easier, and almost any OS is more secure, but that's just jivetalkin as far as he's concerned.  I guess it would be probably true to say that (most) baby boomers are only allowed to learn one OS in their lives.  For my dad, that was Windows 3.1.  So getting new computers with 95, 98, or XP don't count, because they're the same on the outside.  His office computer tech told him to get a Mac, and I tried teaching him how to get around in Linux.  But something as simple as the Gnome desktop is totally foreign to him.

Think of it another way.  I know that if I want to run the web browser, I have to go find it and then somehow start it, usually by double-clicking.  I know that there are icons on my Gnome panel, in my Gnome Applications menu, and in various folders around the filesystem.  Plus, if I want, I can open a terminal and get the web browser that way, because I know where it is, I know what it is called (Firefox), and I know how to launch it from a command line.  So when I double-click a little picture of a fox circling a planet, I know basically what happens behind the scenes.

Contrast that to my dad, who only knows that if he double-clicks that picture on the desktop, the web browser magically appears.  If the desktop icon was gone, he wouldn't be able to open Firefox.  Even though it's in the Start Menu - well, maybe if he fucked around with it for awhile, he might get it to open that way.  And my dad knows that he's not really creating magic by double-clicking, he knows that the web browser (whatever its name is) is a program that he is running -- but that knowledge is divorced from his hand moving the mouse over an icon and clicking twice.

It's the same with your grandmother in the old Cadillac - she knows how to work the steering wheel and pedals, and she may even know that the car needs gasoline to run.  But she doesn't know why the car needs gasoline to run.  And she really doesn't need to in order to drive.  When the car doesn't work as advertised, you can see these people's thought processes: "the key is in the hole, and I turned it, and it doesn't start - is it the right key?"  Same with computers: "I double clicked it and nothing happened, better do it again".

Here we go, I just thought of the perfect way to explain it.  These people are unable to see below their current level of abstraction.  They're so engrossed in the user interface they can't see the machine.  And because of their ignorance, they mistake the user interface for the machine.

As long as this sort of metaphysical engineering continues, there will always be a market for neighborhood mechanics and Microsoft Windows.  Consider yourself fortunate that you have seen beyond the surface down to the next level or 2 - because it's clear that not everyone can do that.
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piratePenguin

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Re: An alien ate your computer
« Reply #4 on: 28 July 2006, 01:13 »
You can put icons on the desktop in GNOME. Drag them from the menu/panel onto the desktop and that's it done.

And you could try giving him that desktop environment designed to emulate Windows...
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"What you share with the world is what it keeps of you."
 - Noah And The Whale: Give a little love



a poem by my computer, Macintosh Vigilante
Macintosh amends a damned around the requested typewriter. Macintosh urges a scarce design. Macintosh postulates an autobiography. Macintosh tolls the solo variant. Why does a winter audience delay macintosh? The maker tosses macintosh. Beneath female suffers a double scum. How will a rat cube the heavier cricket? Macintosh calls a method. Can macintosh nest opposite the headache? Macintosh ties the wrong fairy. When can macintosh stem the land gang? Female aborts underneath macintosh. Inside macintosh waffles female. Next to macintosh worries a well.

hm_murdock

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Re: An alien ate your computer
« Reply #5 on: 28 July 2006, 17:31 »
What you have to do is figure out a way to make him feel like a moron. I've found that's the best/only way to make people switch.
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adiment

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Re: An alien ate your computer
« Reply #6 on: 28 July 2006, 19:41 »
Quote from: hm_murdock
What you have to do is figure out a way to make him feel like a moron. I've found that's the best/only way to make people switch.

That can work. However most people who can be made into morons also become afraid of change.

Maybe try an easy distro like Ubuntu? As piratePenguin said, you can have all the icons and unless your dad uses Windows for some special there is usually an alternative to most common programs; if not you can try Wine (or Crossover office, however most Linux fanboys are against it because it's commercial)
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piratePenguin

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Re: An alien ate your computer
« Reply #7 on: 28 July 2006, 20:04 »
Quote from: etement
(or Crossover office, however most Linux fanboys are against it because it's commercial)

Wine usually does the trick, when it doesn't then you should try crossover office (which I believe you have to pay for, so it's always better to try wine first). Using the non-free crossover office beats going back to Windows any day.
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"What you share with the world is what it keeps of you."
 - Noah And The Whale: Give a little love



a poem by my computer, Macintosh Vigilante
Macintosh amends a damned around the requested typewriter. Macintosh urges a scarce design. Macintosh postulates an autobiography. Macintosh tolls the solo variant. Why does a winter audience delay macintosh? The maker tosses macintosh. Beneath female suffers a double scum. How will a rat cube the heavier cricket? Macintosh calls a method. Can macintosh nest opposite the headache? Macintosh ties the wrong fairy. When can macintosh stem the land gang? Female aborts underneath macintosh. Inside macintosh waffles female. Next to macintosh worries a well.

Aloone_Jonez

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Re: An alien ate your computer
« Reply #8 on: 28 July 2006, 20:37 »
Quote from: worker201
It's hard to explain what makes an older guy (my dad is 66) stick with Windows.


Probably because he stick with what he feels comfortable with which is Windows, anything else looks foreign and older people tend to fear the unfamilure.
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GenuineAdvantage

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Re: An alien ate your computer
« Reply #9 on: 29 July 2006, 00:26 »
Meh. I'd rather lose system files than my user files. I have seen files disappear in linux. One time though, and it may have had something to do with copying a bunch of files over from windows using e2fs. I've stopped using it, the tool and windows, and only time will tell if that was the cause. I hope it was.
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worker201

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Re: An alien ate your computer
« Reply #10 on: 29 July 2006, 00:41 »
Well, it seems like it wasn't really a system file that ate itself, but the hard drive dying.  It appears that we have full recovery, and a new laptop hard drive.  Lovely consumer shit, I suppose.  Personally, I wouldn't buy a Compaq laptop at Best Buy, but then it wasn't my decision to make.

During the rebuilding of the system, I was asked to download 49! Windows updates.  One of which was the Genuine Advantage crap, so I only installed 48! updates.

Also, FYI, it has been made clear to me that there will be NO changing Operating Systems, and THAT's FINAL.  Alrighty then.  As I explained earlier, I guess I understand.
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hm_murdock

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Re: An alien ate your computer
« Reply #11 on: 29 July 2006, 01:35 »
Did you mock him?

"Dew wiw be no changing of oberatin syschums and dat iz teh fynal"
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GenuineAdvantage

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Re: An alien ate your computer
« Reply #12 on: 29 July 2006, 03:00 »
That's what you get when bothering to mention wiping the windows. I never bother, I just throw in a Limited Account and vaguely mention that it's safer. If they ask why I'll answer, but usually it they don't. Screw people, they're on their own. If they ask for help regularly after disregarding advice, I'll do it when I do it. My dad did want linux installed though, strangely enough.
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mobrien_12

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Re: An alien ate your computer
« Reply #13 on: 29 July 2006, 03:32 »
ISAPNP.... very strange considering that windows XP dropped support for the ISA bus and so would have absolutely no need for an ISA PNP system.

Windows 2000, however would.

I guess this is just one more example of how the MSOS is kludged from it's previous versions.
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worker201

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Re: An alien ate your computer
« Reply #14 on: 30 July 2006, 00:45 »
Quote from: mobrien_12
ISAPNP.... very strange considering that windows XP dropped support for the ISA bus and so would have absolutely no need for an ISA PNP system.

Windows 2000, however would.

I guess this is just one more example of how the MSOS is kludged from it's previous versions.
So probably they removed the functionality, but some other internal framework called it, probably for future functionality that was cancelled.  So rather than rewrite the functions that called it for no apparent reason, they left a deprecated file in their core code base.  And even though it has no real function, it's still a required system file.

That's fucking ridiculous.
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