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Author Topic: Linux - Win98 install order  (Read 1110 times)

DC

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Linux - Win98 install order
« on: 9 September 2002, 01:45 »
I want to reinstall my entire system in a short while, to clean up all the old mess and the terrible partitioning system.
My idea was to put Linux on the 40 GB disk (hda), and Windows on the 4 GB disk (hdd) (for compatibility reasons). My Windows of choice is 98.

Now, for various boring reasons, it would be easier to install Linux first, and then Win98. Unfortunatly, that causes a few problems with 98 overwriting the MBR. But I figured that is solvable. I though of two ways:

1) Install Linux
Install Win98
Boot Linux with floppy
Edit lilo.conf (or Grub alternative) and run lilo (grub)

2) Install Linux
Disconnect hda
Install Win98
Connect hda
Boot in Linux
Edit lilo.conf (or Grub alternative) and run lilo (grub)

Now, would these two work? What would be the best and are there other ways?
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A quantummechanical wavefunction describing an unknown amount of bottles of beer on the wall
A quantummechanical wavefunction describing an unknown amount of bottles of beer on the wall
We take a measurement, the wavefunction will collapse, and one of the bottles of beer will fall

voidmain

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Linux - Win98 install order
« Reply #1 on: 9 September 2002, 02:09 »
Yes that will work and I have done it that way before.  Installing basics and boot loader configuration is another thing we need to add to our FAQ (which hasn't been started yet).
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Bazoukas

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Linux - Win98 install order
« Reply #2 on: 9 September 2002, 02:20 »
There is an easier way too guys.

 Install on your Master HD win98. Install on your Slave HD Linux. No need to disconetct anything.

  Configure Grub during installation (Put Grub on MBR). When installation finishes the Penguin will see Win 98 and vuala you have two choices. RH or the Bitch (thats how I named my win98 in Grub).
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DC

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Linux - Win98 install order
« Reply #3 on: 9 September 2002, 02:24 »
Thanks Void Main.

Bazoukas: Linux should be on the master, and installed first, so that's not possible.
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A quantummechanical wavefunction describing an unknown amount of bottles of beer on the wall
A quantummechanical wavefunction describing an unknown amount of bottles of beer on the wall
We take a measurement, the wavefunction will collapse, and one of the bottles of beer will fall

voidmain

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Linux - Win98 install order
« Reply #4 on: 9 September 2002, 02:45 »
But the point is, you *can* install Winblows after installing Linux. Sure the easiest way if you can is to install Winblows first but it only takes a second to boot Linux from a boot disk and rerunning LILO.  People who say you can't install Windows second are full of beans. Of course I would put Windows on the first drive.
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Bazoukas

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Linux - Win98 install order
« Reply #5 on: 9 September 2002, 02:50 »
ops my bad. I didnt read the whole post.
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DC

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Linux - Win98 install order
« Reply #6 on: 9 September 2002, 04:02 »
quote:
Originally posted by void main:
But the point is, you *can* install Winblows after installing Linux.

Good
 
quote:

Sure the easiest way if you can is to install Winblows first

Well, not in my case - I'm using the 4GB disk to hold files I want to take to my new install, so naturally I can't install Windows on it (and I'm NOT installing Windows on the faster 40GB disk either) This is easier (a lot) than burning to CD or something, since I don't have a burner in this PC.
And it sure is easier than formatting part of the 40 GB drive, formatting the 4GB drive and installing Windows, backing up files, formatting part of the 40GB drive and installing Linux, restoring files, finish partitioning and then *really* restore everything how it should be.

 
quote:

but it only takes a second to boot Linux from a boot disk and rerunning LILO.  People who say you can't install Windows second are full of beans. Of course I would put Windows on the first drive.

Well, that would mean I should make the 4 GB disk hda, the DVD player hdb, and the 40GB disk hdc or hdd (I can't put both HD's on the same IDE controller, ATA 33 and ATA 100 don't mix). Or install Windows on the 40GB which - again - is something I won't do. That would all be way to unesthetical, I want Linux and the bootloader on the 40 GB drive on hda, the DVD on hdc and windows on the 4GB on hdd.
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A quantummechanical wavefunction describing an unknown amount of bottles of beer on the wall
A quantummechanical wavefunction describing an unknown amount of bottles of beer on the wall
We take a measurement, the wavefunction will collapse, and one of the bottles of beer will fall

voidmain

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Linux - Win98 install order
« Reply #7 on: 9 September 2002, 04:11 »
The only thing I can't remember for certain is if Win9x will have trouble installing on something other than the first drive.  I know NT/2K have no problem with this but I recall Win98 being more brain dead. It might be the reason I always put it on the first drive (it doesn't have to be the first partition though I do know that for sure, as long as the partitions before the target partition are not FAT* partitions).  Why don't you want to put Windows on the same large drive?  You can always format the smaller drive as a shared work drive (make the big drive the master).
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DC

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Linux - Win98 install order
« Reply #8 on: 9 September 2002, 18:42 »
quote:
Originally posted by void main:
The only thing I can't remember for certain is if Win9x will have trouble installing on something other than the first drive.  I know NT/2K have no problem with this but I recall Win98 being more brain dead.

Really? That might be a problem. Would installing on hda, swapping and using it with hdd work?
 
quote:

Why don't you want to put Windows on the same large drive?  You can always format the smaller drive as a shared work drive (make the big drive the master).

I don't need shared work, I'll just use the Win98 disk for all stuff that needs to be transferred (it'll be used mostly for games anyway, so not much transferring).

But the larger drive is faster and newer (= more reliable). Plus it's easier to keep the two seperated in case I need to move one of the hard disks (this may occur if I need extra space on my other PC). So I want Win98 on the 4GB disk, and NOT on the 40GB.
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A quantummechanical wavefunction describing an unknown amount of bottles of beer on the wall
A quantummechanical wavefunction describing an unknown amount of bottles of beer on the wall
We take a measurement, the wavefunction will collapse, and one of the bottles of beer will fall

voidmain

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Linux - Win98 install order
« Reply #9 on: 10 September 2002, 03:27 »
quote:
Originally posted by DC:
Really? That might be a problem. Would installing on hda, swapping and using it with hdd work?


One way to find out, give it a shot. And swapping disks after an install is possible with Linux as long as you realize that you must change the device names in /etc/fstab and in the boot loader (and intall the boot loader on the MBR of the first drive).  For the /etc/fstab that's pretty easy, just change it before you shut down and swap the drives.  

For the boot loader it might be easiest to make a boot floppy so you can boot up after swapping drives and then reinstall the boot loader after making appropriate changes to the boot loader's config file.  You will also have to pass a parameter to your boot disk telling the kernel where the new location of the root file system is.  It's not really a big deal though, I have done it on more than one occasion.

Another option is to stick the smaller drive on the first channel and the bigger one on the second channel. If you later remove the first drive you might still have to change the /etc/fstab and boot loader if the device names change.  An alternate method is changing the fstab settings by booting in rescue mode from the install CD, or using Tom's boot disk, or knoppix CD, etc, then mount the root file system on the hard drive, then modifying the fstab. I've done it that way as well. But again, that's only if you move/remove a drive to where the device names will change.

[ September 09, 2002: Message edited by: void main ]

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imthesponge

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Linux - Win98 install order
« Reply #10 on: 10 September 2002, 20:55 »
ok this is what you've gotta do:
1. install linux on hda but leave a small (20 mb) fat partition at the end... (give it a volume label like win98 or something)
2. format the 4GB disk... put a volume label on it too
3. make a linux boot floppy
4. make the fat partition you created earlier active, and make the linux partition hidden
5. use a win98 startup disk and type dir c: and dir d: to check the label and make sure its the right partition
6. install win98, when it asks for an install directory put D:\WINDOWS
7. let it set up and everything when its finished go into fdisk and make the linux partition active again
8. boot up with the linux floppy, edit lilo to boot from the linux partition and the fat partition at the end of the disk (not the 4GB disk)

then it should work... i did it before to dual boot w2000 and win98 doing it with linux shouldn't be too hard

[ September 10, 2002: Message edited by: imthesponge ]

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Calum

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Linux - Win98 install order
« Reply #11 on: 10 September 2002, 21:55 »
that's a really good solution! i like it.  
quote:
Well, not in my case - I'm using the 4GB disk to hold files I want to take to my new install, so naturally I can't install Windows on it (and I'm NOT installing Windows on the faster 40GB disk either) This is easier (a lot) than burning to CD or something, since I don't have a burner in this PC.
And it sure is easier than formatting part of the 40 GB drive, formatting the 4GB drive and installing Windows, backing up files, formatting part of the 40GB drive and installing Linux, restoring files, finish partitioning and then *really* restore everything how it should be.
that's actually what i would have done:

made 2 partitions on the big drive, one fat32 and one ext2 or ext3, then i would have stuck all the files on the fat32 partition and installed windows on the small drive (which would be the first hard drive) then i would make the big one the second drive and install linux onto it. this way i would have all my files on a neutral fat32 partition accessible by both systems.

edit:- but i think that imthesponge's solution is better...

[ September 10, 2002: Message edited by: Calum ]

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voidmain

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Linux - Win98 install order
« Reply #12 on: 11 September 2002, 01:26 »
The only problem with installing Windows on "D:" is you can then not separate the drives later. But then I would use both drives for Linux and skip the Winblows part altogether.    And use VMware if Windows is necessary like I do now. Then moving things around is easy.
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Calum

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« Reply #13 on: 12 September 2002, 16:48 »
hey, isn't the 'installing window son d:' thing just so you can install it on the second drive? i was under the impression that you would later change it round so that physical drive would then be c:, but if d:/windows is hardlinked into the system then putting windows on the secondary drive seems a bit pointless to me.
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foobar

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« Reply #14 on: 12 September 2002, 18:10 »
umm ... Void spoke somewhere about a FAQ ... is it going to be on the fuckmicrosoft.com portal ?
And if you would appreciate, could i help translating it into dutch ?
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