Why RedHat8.0 wont have KDE ?

[Bazoukas]

Is this true? That RH wont put KDE in their 8.0?
And if so, whats the real reason for it? They want to keep alive gnome? Maybe because KDE is writen in C++?


  If this is true, that will just be stupid.  I am on RH and its what i realy wantand like. I use almost exclusivly Gnome (i think its much more practical than KDE).

  Saying that though, if there is no GOOD reason for RedHat for not putting KDE in, then that will piss me off.

 KDE is very popular and people want it and by not including it in RH8 it sends a signal of the type of which i dont like.


  I thought the whole spirit of the Penguin is to promote the BEST of ALL kinds and types of software.

  If there isnt any good reason for RH not to include KDE, then Debian is my next choice.

 Yeah, I am a romantic not a fanatic. There are such things such as being loyal and believing to an idea.
  And in the Case of the Linux Operating Systems, the idea is to share knowledge and promote the best with out using dirty bitch tactical moves.

[ September 20, 2002: Message edited by: bazoukas ]

[Master of Reality]

if there is no KDE then i wont be upgrading to it or i will just install KDE afterwards. In Red Hat 7.3 they got rid of enlightenment, maybe they are slowly trying ro abolish GUIs??

[ September 20, 2002: Message edited by: The Master of Reality / Bob ]

[rtgwbmsr]

Wouldn't it be funny if they went command line only?

I agree with Master of Reality. I won't be using it, unless I install KDE myself. I probably won't be using it at all...I have come to depise Red Hat recently.

KDE's best advantage: Konquerer. The equivalent of M$ Explorer (YUK!) I can browse files, the web, and open all types of compressed files in the GUI.

[orcpeon]

Dude I don't know who's been lying to you but I'm using the 8.0 beta as I write this and it has KDE 3.03!  Works very well, too.  It comes using the "red hat" bluecurve theme by default so the apps look the same, but you can easily change it back.

Red Hat is NOT a company to be despised in my opinion.  They are nothing like Microsoft, and Linux would be a lot farther behind without them.  Any company that lets you download their OS for free from their website is good in my book.

[ September 20, 2002: Message edited by: Orc Peon ]

[orcpeon]

quote: KDE's best advantage: Konquerer. The equivalent of M$ Explorer (YUK!) I can browse files, the web, and open all types of compressed files in the GUI.

You'll like the new nautilus better than Konqueror.  It can't browse the web, (but why use Konq when you can use Mozilla or Galeon?) but it is very fast now and is very nice to look at.

[Master of Reality]

ya, where did you hear that redhat didnt come with KDE???!!! Isearched for a while and found nothing of the such. I will probly be upgrading to Red Hat 8.0.
Red Hat has been my favorite distro so far.

[orcpeon]

quote: In Red Hat 7.3 they got rid of enlightenment, maybe they are slowly trying ro abolish GUIs??

No, it's just that E is pretty much dead and GNOME fits a lot better into their vision of the Linux desktop.  You can, of course, download enlightenment RPM's and install it yourself.  But, I can see why Red Hat doesn't want to confuse people by putting 12 window managers in their OS.  8.0 only comes with GNOME and KDE, and doesn't even install KDE by default (but it's very easy to select it in the add/remove packages section)

I'm also tired of everyone riding red hat these days and giving them such a hard time.  You know they are the ONLY Linux company so far getting into the desktop area that isn't going to force you to pay for it in some way. (unlike those filthy bastards at Lindows.com and Xandros)

[ September 20, 2002: Message edited by: Orc Peon ]

[Master of Reality]

Lycoris, Mandrake.
you have to pay for Xandros?

[rtgwbmsr]

quote:Originally posted by Orc Peon:
I'm also tired of everyone riding red hat these days and giving them such a hard time.  You know they are the ONLY Linux company so far getting into the desktop area that isn't going to force you to pay for it in some way. (unlike those filthy bastards at Lindows.com and Xandros)

If they were the only choice where you didn't have to pay, I would use Red Hat. But, since I have the freedom of choice, I can download something easier to use.
Is Red Hat a bitch sometimes? Yes.
Will I try 8.0? Yes, I'd like to see if the've improved anything.
Will I advocate Red Hat as much as I used to? Yes. Just because it was a pain in the ass to me doesn't mean it will be a pain to the next guy. And it's only pulling shit on one system, my other system's RH installation is great, and I haven't had one problem. Red Hat is also the only Linux OS (to my knowledge) with a "...For Dummies" book.

RH does have KDE BTW. My friend just installed it, so I called him, and he says it's there. Maybe bazoukas skipped over it in the install?

[ September 21, 2002: Message edited by: The_Muffin_Man/B0b ]

[voidmain]

I am in complete agreement about RedHat. I used to flip flop between it and Slackware until RedHat 3.0 came out, then I've stuck with RedHat as my primary Linux OS both at work and at home. And it's what I use in my side business.

I also use Konqueror over mozilla and any other browser for a couple of reasons. 99% of the time I access this site from my old Dell laptop, sitting on the couch working and watching baseball. It's a 350Mhz Latitude with 64MB of RAM. Konqueror is by far the fastest and lightest feeling browser on this machine. It works very well, great control over cookies/javascript/java etc. It's very compatible and I like the fonts better than any of the others.

Now I haven't tried the new Gnome 2.x or the new Nautilus yet as it was not ready when RedHat 7.3 came out which is what I have been using for some time now. I am very happy with KDE 3.x a huge improvement over 2.x.  If Gnome has as drastic of an improvement when I get RedHat 8.0 next week (or whenever it is released final) I will certainly give it a look.

Historically KDE has won the desktop battles on my machines for quite some time now. Actually prior to KDE 3.x I was using Windowmaker on this laptop because KDE 2.x and Gnome were too resource intensive. KDE 3.x seems to be much improved as far as speed and resources on this old machine.

All I can say is, I am excited about RedHat 8.0 where I am usually not in any big hurry for their *.0 release.

[Bazoukas]

I read it in the KDE forums. I dont have the link though.

  I am glad that this seems to be just a bullshit rumor. I should had research it 1st.

  I realy am fond of RedHat, from the way they started and so far its been the best X flavor i tried.

[voidmain]

I don't believe it was ever stated that RedHat would not ship KDE. The issues KDE has with RedHat is RedHat is doing a lot of KDE customizing/hacking and not promptly merging the source back into KDE for everyone to share. Now I don't believe they are doing a "lot" of hacking and KDE can certainly merge any RedHat changes back into the code that they want. After all, that's what the GPL is all about.  I don't believe they would be happy either way.  If RedHat took the lead and tried to merge the code they would complain that RedHat is trying to drive the project.

The real underlying problem is that RedHat has always been pro-Gnome and used to install Gnome by default. Well, for the last several releases if you do a Custom install you could select which of the two or both you want to install and which you want to be the "default" desktop. I believe one of the RedHat big wigs is actually one of the founding programmers of the Gnome project so I can see where they would have a preference. Another big issue is they are supposed to be makeing Gnome and KDE both look pretty much the same (hmmmm, standardization by a distro vendor? Tell me it isn't so! Hell, isn't standardization what a lot of people cry about wanting?).

Now I personally like the way KDE 3.x is packaged out of the box so I'll have to reserve judgement until I get RH8.0 before deciding one way or the other. And if I have the option of clicking a button to get KDE back to default then I see no complaint...

[Bazoukas]

In that case Mister, I will venture out and get me 8.0. Even though from what i read and from what you said  the 0 versions are traditionaly a headache.

[lazygamer]

quote:
I'm also tired of everyone riding red hat these days and giving them such a hard time. You know they are the ONLY Linux company so far getting into the desktop area that isn't going to force you to pay for it in some way. (unlike those filthy bastards at Lindows.com and Xandros)

It has to do with alot of people here being anti-corporation. Look at Intel, RIAA, Microsoft etc. Alot of sad stuff listed. So Redhat gets the finger pointing because they are rather large for a Linux company, however this also means that they can spread the gospel of Linux due to their size and leverage.

Hmmmm getting tempted to try installing Redhat.  

[voidmain]

Gamer, I would generally agree with that statement. We are generally anti large corporation because many large corporations are evil. So far I have not seen this with RedHat, and as I mentioned several times previously I got really pissed off the day RedHat announced their IPO for fear of them becoming one of those evil corporations.

Although I think it is good to maintain a watchful eye I have not yet seen anything out of RedHat to make them fall into this category. They have been nothing but good for Linux in my opinion. As long as they keep up the attitude they have had over the last 8 years we'll be in good shape.

I don't see them changing it any time soon as they have been a successful Linux business without any shenanigans. By successful I mean they about break even which is good. The day they think they need to back yearly profits in the billions, that's the day we need to start worrying.