war not going too well

[Calum]

i never thought "operation iraqi liberation", or as we out here in the free world call it THE WAR, was a good idea, but now our troops are in their surely it's their duty to hurry up and wrap it up as soon as possible and get out fast?

apparently not:


http://www.guardian.co.uk/Iraq/dailybriefi...,927233,00.html

 

quote:The invasion forces suffered another self-inflicted disaster in the battle for hearts and minds yesterday when soldiers from the US 3rd infantry division shot dead Iraqi seven women and children.

The incident occurred on Route 9, near Najaf, when a car carrying 13 women and children approached a checkpoint.

A US military spokesman says the soldiers motioned the vehicle to stop but their signals were ignored. However, according to the Washington Post, Captain Ronny Johnson, who was in charge of the checkpoint, blamed his own troops for ignoring orders to fire a warning shot.

"You just f***ing killed a family because you didn't fire a warning shot soon enough!", he reportedly yelled at them.

so, anybody got any idea how they could kill less innocents and get the job finished fast? why not write to your local representative too with your ideas?

[Pantso]

I wish that this were the only incident were innocent civilians got killed in this unjust war. Apparently though, that is not the case, since the US air-fighters bombed a hospital in Baghdad today. A few days ago they also bombed a market place in Baghdad and killed tens and hundreds of children and civilians.

I'm aware that in the UK, images of dismembered or burnt to death children, are not allowed to be broadcasted on national television. I'm also aware that this is the case in the United States as well.

However, here in Greece we see such pictures every day and believe me, it's not a beautiful sight when you see burnt to death children piled up out there on the streets.

I'm certain that many soldiers have died in this madness as well, which also makes me sad, since they really died for NOTHING. There is no honour for a soldier to die in an unjust battle.

Sadly, this will go on for more days, weeks or even months and who knows how many more people will get killed during the battles there. The only question I can ask in this case is why?

[ April 02, 2003: Message edited by: Panos ]

[rtgwbmsr]

quote:Originally posted by Calum: crusader for peace & freedom:
Why not write to your local representative too with your ideas?

Because my representatives don't give a shit, won't reply, and god forbid they do, it would take years. The war will hopefully be over by then.

[Kintaro]

I actually cant think of a better way, unjust my ass, saddam needs to be stopped, it is unjust that civillians are getting killed, but then saddam kills thousands a year to cover his tracks.

My thought on the war: /dev/null]

I have no thought on the war.

[Stryker]

the commander was full of shit. They are told to give a warning (a sign, or verbally), and if they dont stop then shoot. They are not instructed to give warning shots. It's too bad that they died, very sad indeed. But they were in the wrong and they had it coming. If someone tells you to stop, and they are holding guns being backed up by an army, you stop. This was one of the few just killing of civilians. There's no way to tell who or what was in that trick. They could have had a bomb in there. And if they did find a bomb, everyone would shut up about the event and be happy. Bah. i'm done, need food.

[silentwarrior]

Wow..killing innocent does not affact US mids...but rescuing 7 POWs makes them so proud that they make breaking news for it...haha..shame on US..haha...

[zoolooo]

German propaganda trends from 1938 to 1945

"We've won the war"

"We will win the war"

"We must win the war"

Point 2 has been reached.

zooloo

[silentwarrior]

may be US is "about to win war" but worst thing is US is losing image in other countries by declaring wars...

[cahult]

Well, the military war is already won by the so called coalition but I

[SpeeDFreaK]

You know what's really funny? Listening to people who are utterly convinced the United States will win this war quickly and cleanly. In my sociology class, this one girl who if I remember correctly, has had previous military experience, believes that when the  US surrounds Baghdad on all sides, they will go French and throw down their guns. I kept my mouth shut because I didn't want to keep her going, but DAMN! She sounded so sure that they would be so scared shiatless they would just give up. It was like watching that pentagon press briefing a few days ago and the spokeswoman sounded so sure of herself:

 

quote: Q: For the general. You had said you'd seen a very significant weakening of the Iraqi Republican Guard. And then you also said that once you take the system, that whole system starts to go down. That sort of echoes what a senior defense official was saying earlier today in Doha, Qatar; he was saying that he senses a tipping point -- they sense a tipping point in Basra and Nasiriyah, and once that comes, it all starts to spread.

Do you actually -- is this a beginning of a tipping point?

McChrystal: Ma'am, I couldn't say that I see a tipping point, but we clearly look for that. That's true in units, it's true in places like Basra and an-Nasiriyah. And that's what we're working towards.

Q: But is the -- you were -- elaborate a little bit on that very significant weakening of the Iraqi Republican Guard. Is this reaching a tipping point there?

McChrystal: Yes, ma'am, we see some very significant weakening, and it will hit a tipping point in some of their formations.

Clarke: I would just go back to a vision Secretary Rumsfeld used yesterday on the shows, is put yourself in Saddam Hussein's shoes. You're losing control over more and more of your country; you have forces coming at you from every direction. It is not a good picture for him. But we always say in the same sentence, some of the toughest fighting could lie ahead. The outcome is inevitable. We know how it will end: the Iraqi regime will end. But we know that there could be some tough fighting ahead.

Jamie?

Q: Torie, one of the underpinnings of the strategy that the U.S. is using is what you keep to referring to, this -- creating the feeling that there's an inevitable outcome. That's --

Clarke: The inevitable outcome is more than a feeling --

Q: Well --

Clarke: -- it is reality.

Q: -- except, wouldn't you concede that at this point in the campaign, whether it's premature or not, you have yet to achieve that feeling of inevitability among the Iraqi people and the Iraqi leadership?

Clarke: Again, I'd push back on how you're saying it. It's not a feeling that we will achieve, it is the inevitable outcome that the Iraqi regime will be ended, the Iraqi people will be free of decades and decades and decades of torture and oppression, the likes of which I think the world has not ever seen before [SIC -- is one of the worst in history]; and we'll find the WMD and we'll get rid of it. That is absolutely inevitable.

What goes on in the mind of every one of the Iraqis, I don't know. I know if I were an Iraqi citizen I'd be saying, "Huh. Look at what's been going on here for the last 10 days -- or 12 days -- and we haven't seen any of our leaders." That's pretty extraordinary, when you think about it.

Bob?  

From http://east.defenselink.mil/news/Mar2003/t03312003_t0331asd.html

I wish that this would end quickly, I honestly do, but I had to laugh when I saw her say this.

[Calum]

i actually saw on another forum where an american had said that because he had read a few reports that the war wasn't going well, he was now unable to believe any reports. his justification was that the US were obviously winning with no problems whatever and so he felt that any reports to the contrary must be untrue. and as for this:
 

quote:Originally posted by Stryker:
the commander was full of shit. They are told to give a warning (a sign, or verbally), and if they dont stop then shoot. They are not instructed to give warning shots. It's too bad that they died, very sad indeed. But they were in the wrong and they had it coming. If someone tells you to stop, and they are holding guns being backed up by an army, you stop. This was one of the few just killing of civilians. There's no way to tell who or what was in that trick. They could have had a bomb in there. And if they did find a bomb, everyone would shut up about the event and be happy. Bah. i'm done, need food.

i have absolutely no comment to make about this entire quote. this is the typical attitude that i see in the foreign actions of the USA. this is the reason they are at war, and this is the reason they will attack Syria and Iran next (mark my words, six months to a year of propaganda from now, you'll be seeing a lot of people on these forums calling for all out war on those countries too). If you can't see why i am disgusted with Siplus' comments then there really is nothing i can say to explain it to you.

[slave]

quote:

i have absolutely no comment to make about this entire quote. this is the typical attitude that i see in the foreign actions of the USA. this is the reason they are at war, and this is the reason they will attack Syria and Iran next (mark my words, six months to a year of propaganda from now, you'll be seeing a lot of people on these forums calling for all out war on those countries too). If you can't see why i am disgusted with Siplus' comments then there really is nothing i can say to explain it to you.

Oh, there's no doubt in my mind we'll go to war with Iran.  After all, it's part of Bush's "Axis of Evil."  I remember back when the US was attacking Afghanistan some people were saying "I bet Bush will go after Iraq next!"  And I was like, "Come on, what does Iraq have to do with 9/11?  Bush may not be my favorite president, but he would never do something so reckless!  Stop making these wild conjectures."  Oh well.

However, Iran would be a tougher target.  The terrain is worse there and the Iranians are better equipped.

As for Syria, check out this article:

http://www.forward.com/issues/2003/03.04.04/news4.html

[slave]

Also, check out this web site:

Iraq Body Count

Apparently the total number of Iraqi civilians directly killed by the US and its allies is at least 500 so far.  And how long has this war been going on?  3 weeks?

Boy, "shock and awe" sure does suck if you're the receiving end!

[ April 03, 2003: Message edited by: Linux User #5225982375 ]

[Pantso]

Those of you who are against the war can always sign  this declaration or petition if you prefer. This is a petition that Richard Stallman also promotes and encourages in his home page.