Author Topic: If you ran MS.  (Read 2080 times)

muzzy

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Re: If you ran MS.
« Reply #15 on: 27 April 2005, 00:53 »
About tightening the API, it could be done without breaking backwards compatibility. Here's how:

First, let applications to provide manifests for what they want from the APIs, exactly. After that, things other than these wouldn't just work. This wouldn't break anything, since applications would themselves state what they want and what they don't. This is important because it's theoretically impossible to determine if an application does action X during its runtime or not, without actually running it. If the application states that it's not going to do it, then the mechanism doesn't need to be provided and the application is known to be safe in that regard.

Provide a developer version of windows which requires that all applications manifest what they need, and by default applications run in a very restricted environment with limited API availability, registry and filesystem scope and so on. Developers don't mind it as much as the masses do. Developers can fix things. Developers can hack. Since this version of windows would be extremely security restricted, it should be made "free" and installable alongside any other properly licensed windows system. Give enough powertoy goodies with this release to make developers prefer it, and all future applications will come with proper manifests shipped.

In few years, once there's a significant amount of manifested applications in the market (or perhaps even earlier) release a tool for manifest auditing. The tool would be used to scan system for any non-manifested software, and to determine which applications require privileged API functionality such as unlimited GetAsyncKeyState, SetWindowsHookEx, AttachThreadInput which are used for keyloggers. Properly behaving applications don't need to GetAsyncKeyState while they aren't active, or do global hooks, or attach themselves to threads they don't own. Non-manifested applications thus simply couldn't act as keyloggers, as they wouldn't have access to the required APIs to implement them. Same applies for many other sorts of malware, they still need APIs to function.

Once most commonly used applications are manifested, release Server edition which allows for manifest signing. So, no applications will run on the server unless they come with a manifest signed by the administrator. The signed manifest will specify exactly what APIs the application is allowed to access and so on, and everything will be fine and happy. If this works fine, release same and similar functionality for home systems, which warn users if they're trying to run application that requires risky functionality. They might still click yes, but at least they'll have the choice.

Finally, this will need some design changes as well to allow for finer granularity of the manifest checking. A text editor needs to save the file, but otherwise it won't need to read/write anything on its own. An ideal solution would be that the text editor saves data to a stream, and the stream is saved by a common control which lets the user choose where to write the data. This way the files in text editor could only be opened through user interaction, with exception of special files in manifested directories. I'm sure Microsoft has resources to make this design change if it wants to, and it's only necessary to let applications manifest strict scopes while allowing broad access to the system for the user.

Oh my, that's long. I hope the idea got through, I've been thinking about this for a few days now :p

skyman8081

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Re: If you ran MS.
« Reply #16 on: 27 April 2005, 09:25 »
That doesn't suprise me, MS doesn't have anywhere to go from here, hence why they are trying to diversify their range of products so that they can keep growing instead of stagnating at the top.  If Windows is a commodity, it's hard to try and keep marketing it.  Why do you think MS is pushing the Xbox, they need it.  Windows and Office won't stay profitable forever, and MS is smart, they know this.

Anyway, If I ran MS, I would also focus a lot more on the Xbox and Xbox 360 to make it a profitable revenue stream, at the same time, as I said, making longhorn the best OS it can be.  Bar all backwards compatability, it keeps it from advancing.
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muzzy

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Re: If you ran MS.
« Reply #17 on: 27 April 2005, 11:04 »
Backwards compatibility is one of the reasons MS has kept their dominance on OS market. It'd be stupid to throw it all away.

cahult

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Re: If you ran MS.
« Reply #18 on: 27 April 2005, 11:53 »
What did MS start out with? What was their main work in the 70
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Kintaro

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Re: If you ran MS.
« Reply #19 on: 28 April 2005, 03:23 »
If I was in charge of Microsoft I would cut back on spending money on research and development and instead form a special team of spies who just go steal other companies ideas for me. I would increase the amount of money that flows into my back pocket and fill my driveway with nice cars.

Aloone_Jonez

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Re: If you ran MS.
« Reply #20 on: 28 April 2005, 11:39 »
Why can't the rewrite ther OS break all backwards compatability and then use a Wine like compatability layer to run all of the legacy code?

After all this is how UNIX can run Windows programs and how Windows NTxruns old Win3.x 16-bit programs.
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Kintaro

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Re: If you ran MS.
« Reply #21 on: 29 April 2005, 03:30 »
Quote from: Aloone_Jonez
Why can't the rewrite ther OS break all backwards compatability and then use a Wine like compatability layer to run all of the legacy code?

After all this is how UNIX can run Windows programs and how Windows NTxruns old Win3.x 16-bit programs.

 NT can still execute them native to a certain extent.