All Things Microsoft > Microsoft Software
Windows Sucks
toadlife:
--- Quote from: piratePenguin ---:D
"Removal of infections would be easier since the virus wouldn't have the benefit of root permissions" There's at least one benefit of the masses switching from Windows to GNU/Linux right there. Thanks!
--- End quote ---
Yes - one small benefit. The problem is the vast majority of people who's machines are "owned" never realize it, so the ease of removal itself becomes irrelevant.
--- Quote from: piratePenguin --- "damage to the internet"? I don't see how that has anything to do with what OS everyone is using.
"the damage to the internet (spam/DoS bots) would be the same."
Umm... I think the hole "dangerous internet" arguement is quite-irelevent. It has nothing to do with OSes AFAIK, and I can't see it being fixed anytime soon.
--- End quote ---
We're looking at this from different philosophical viewpoints. You hate Microsoft and are on the Free/freedom bandwagon, so the simple act of moving away from Windows, regarless of the real benefits to the world is enough you. The problem of "owned" machines is very relevant to me as am IT professional who is affected by what goes on on the internet. If I thought everyone switching to linux could help solve the problem of spam/DoS bots, then I would be all for it.
--- Quote from: piratePenguin ---Right now, such a system is not necessary. One day it might be. And it will be provided. Free(-of-charge) or otherwise.
--- End quote ---
Sure it will be provided - it would have to be. But I can assure you, it will not be free.
piratePenguin:
--- Quote from: xyle_one ---The learning curve for a user that hasn't used either system would be equal
--- End quote ---
I wouldn't have thought that because:
Windows is very n00b-friendly. And it's good at being n00b-friendly of all things.
It's much more n00b-friendly than almost all GNU/Linux distros, except the ones targeted at n00bs themselves (and I'd say it'd still be a tough one).
Kudos to MS. For their software is friendly to (the millions of) n00bs.
If the first computer I got had Slackware on it rather than Windows 95, I probably wouldn't have ever bothered with the computer at all. Although if it was Ubuntu (which didn't exist at the time but what the hell), I probably would've used it. And as soon as I knew how to use it, I probably would have learned all about the command-line and then more advanced stuff. And I probably would be on Slackware in no-time.
The leaning-curves are beautiful on GNU/Linux, especially for the curious ones, and also for the not-so-curious ones.
--- Quote from: xyle_one ---For a windows user going to Linux, its more difficult.
--- End quote ---
Definetly!
I'd say it wouldn't be too hard for a Slackware user (who has never used Windows before) to migrate to Windows.
Even though they're used to doing things "the hard way", they'd figure the easy way out just as easy as the n00bs would.
Obviously they wouldn't feel at home. For Windows was not developed with them-kinda-people inmind (and yes, I mean it).
--- Quote from: xyle_one ---I am very much anti-windows, and I have my reasons. I just don't see anyone giving a good excuse for such hatred of a company.
--- End quote ---
My personal experience with Windows was not pretty.
I do not like MS's software. I do not like MS's evil business practices. I do not like MS's incredible control. I do not like the fucking insane amount of support MS gets (from OEMs, manufacturers, etc.) when there are much better alternatives out there. And I definetly do not like MS's FUD (especially when people buy it).
They are evil bastards who do NOT deserve my support.
And buying their products IS supporting them, just like using their products is.
On the other hand, I fucking love the GNU philosophy.
It is right. It is good. It is honourable. It makes sense.
It is a step forward for mankind.
IT deserves my support, and it deserves more support than the world could possibly supply (and it isn't supplyin', BTW).
--- Quote from: xyle_one ---I am "free" to install what software is available on any system I use. I am "free" to run any os i deem necessary to accomplish whatever task is at hand. I am not bound to only use Windows because Mr. Gates tells me to. Now, I am not free to modify or see the source of MS software. But that doesn't concern me. I am not a developer, I dont snoop through code, or wish to make those kinds of changes. If the software doesnt work the way I want, I find something else. Most of the time, MS software fails me. Windows failed me. So I don't use it. I have it at work, because I don't care enough to migrate my mail, my settings, my work environment to another system. I am leaving this place in one week anyways.
--- End quote ---
If that's what you call freedom, seems a little shallow to me. You are damn right to but "free" in quotation marks though.
--- Quote from: xyle_one ---As for giving employees linux. I am not having them create print and web materials with GIMP. It has never been up to the task.
--- End quote ---
That's interesting - explain please.
--- Quote from: xyle_one ---Not that I actually prefer them to use Windows, but it is the best tool at my disposal currently. We are not a mac shop. I will never convince management to invest in Apple machines. Linux will not cut it. Maybe for the techs, and maybe for sales and billing, but not my department. In that sense, we are not "free". We are tied to windows. I just don't see it as being that big of a deal. Not anymore.
--- End quote ---
How in the hell isn't it a big deal?
Do you have computers on-show kinda thing? Because if you do, you could put Ubuntu or something decent on it, and tell the customers a little about GNU/Linux. Then give them the CHOICE between Windows and Ubuntu. The choice that so many of them never got...
Jenda:
The freedom IMHO is in the independence from the Empire. You can indeed switch OSes any time you want, and often without even losing your data, but more importantly, you are Free to give your favorite GNU/Linux distro to your friends, install it on any computer that crosses your path and, of course, your toaster.
And then there's the part where you become a member of a community. A community in which people are there to help you, and to recieve your help. The community stands on Free standards, and the people who contribute to the software do so only because they want to (with a few lucky exceptions). Feedback is usually enough of a reward.
I myself am now at the lowest levels of the community, learning, accepting. I am slowly rising, though, and who knows, maybe one day, I'll make my own distro, or fund an OSS project, or just help someone who is having trouble with their computer.
A question rises, though, and that is: will the community hold as strong if GNU/Linux starts dominating the IT world?
I, for one, believe it will.
piratePenguin:
--- Quote from: toadlife ---Yes - one small benefit. The problem is the vast majority of people who's machines are "owned" never realize it, so the ease of removal itself becomes irrelevant.
--- End quote ---
Wait, isn't this about viruses? If the virus is bad enough, wouldn't it be known to the user?
--- Quote from: toadlife ---We're looking at this from different philosophical viewpoints. You hate Microsoft and are on the Free/freedom bandwagon, so the simple act of moving away from Windows, regarless of the real benefits to the world is enough you.
--- End quote ---
:confused: I hate MS, I hate Windows. I hated Windows before I hated MS. I hated MS before I heard anything about GNU or GNU/Linux.
--- Quote from: toadlife ---The problem of "owned" machines is very relevant to me as am IT professional who is affected by what goes on on the internet. If I thought everyone switching to linux could help solve the problem of spam/DoS bots, then I would be all for it.
--- End quote ---
You said yourself nothing would change.
--- Quote from: toadlife ---Sure it will be provided - it would have to be. But I can assure you, it will not be free.
--- End quote ---
If it's free software that's all I ask. I wouldn't mind paying for the service. And I'd more than likely be paying the makers of whatever distro I use. Perhaps an incentive for me to spend some money on this excellent free software I use all the time.
And, it could be free. You do not know.
If MS fell to GNU/Linux, somebody would be making alot of money. Probably Red Hat or Novell, would come out on top. They'd sell software, and if it was good software (or the best distro for me), and it was free software, I'd buy it. If it wasn't free software, I'd stick to free software.
mattymanx:
I don't have any real problems with windows. Its IE I hate.
Thank God for FireFox!
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