Stop Microsoft
All Things Microsoft => Microsoft Software => Topic started by: madmarky on 3 September 2002, 19:52
-
There was once a time when I was totally against M$, Windows and Bill Gates. I started trying out different forms of linux and realised that M$ was my only option...
I am now back on Windows XP Pro. Why? Because of hardware. In Windows all my hardware works great but in other x86 OS's it does not. In fact I spent alot of wasted time looking for drivers and ways to get it working but I got absolutely nowhere. In Linux the following hardware on my pc either does not work at all or does not work properly: Modem, Multimedia Keyboard, Trackball, Printer and Scanner. This is why I'm back in Windows. At least it works!! I realise that M$ is a pile of **** and one reason why my hardware works with windows is cos they've struck deals with manufacturers etc but until linux catches up and my hardware works I'm prepared to stick with windows.
Has anyone else been in my situation? Replies would be much appreciated.
-
I have been in yout exact position, I moved a couple boxes back to win98SE because of it... from now on, every computer I perchase is gonna have linux compatable components. May I ask why XP Pro? why not 2K? I think you know what I'm getting at..... If your gonna use XP just get the cheaper slightly more stable version of it, ME (http://smile.gif)
but back on subject, I know what you mean, however I put forth the effort needed to get myself out of bill'z grips
FUCK MICROSOFT!
-
If you don't buy proprietary hardware Linux works great. And proprietary hardware is usually inferior. If you really want to get rid of MS and run Linux you will get rid of your MS PC and build one for Linux. "I will use Linux when Linux recognizes all my hardware" is a cop out.
-
I believe Penguin Digital Solutions make Liunx ready PC's.
Oh no that's my imaginary company. (http://forum.fuckmicrosoft.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=5&t=000712)
-
If you really were concerned about having all your hardware easily working and still having a *NUX based OS, and NOT giving any money to M$ you should try Mac OS X. (If you can afford a system (http://smile.gif) )
-
Next time you buy a PC make sure it has none of that proprietary hardware. Get a hardware list from the retailer and check every piece on one of the several webpages telling what will work with Linux and what won't. And do not not not not not buy one with windoze pre-installed. That will just give BillyG more money with which to make those fascist deals with hardware manufacturers. What kind of computer do you have? Maybe its time for a new one already. Use Win2K, not XP. XP is evil beyond evil. Going from any other OS to XP completes your journey to Micro$lavery.
V
-
quote:
Originally posted by K7_and_Linux...:
If your gonna use XP just get the cheaper slightly more stable version of it, ME (http://smile.gif)
[QB]
What in the fuck are you talking about man? Windows ME(Windows 9x period) is a pile of crap. Win9x is nowhere near NT in stability/reliability. Do you know why Win9x is so unstable? Because it is a 32bit patch for a 16bit shell(Win3.x) sitting on top of an 8bit foundation(DOS). That is a big reason why Win9x is good at having I/O conflict errors(because it partially relies on DOS to set the I/O functions, IRQs, DMAs, etc.). The dependency of DOS is also a big reason why Win9x is good at causing BSODs(DOS is using some of your memory addresses at all times and when Windows tries to use a memory address that is already being used by DOS it will cause a crash).
Windows NT based OSes on the other hand are fully 32-bit(not a 32bit patch for a 16bit shell on an 8bit system) and has no dependencies of any other OS(like DOS). Windows NT has full access to memory addresses, it has full access to I/O, DMA, IRQ address configurations, etc.
The loss of the old sloppy 8-bit OS(DOS) greatly increases the stability of Windows. Anybody who claims that Win9x is more stable than a NT based OS is a fool.
quote:
Originally posted by Doctor V:
[QB]Next time you buy a PC make sure it has none of that proprietary hardware. Get a hardware list from the retailer and check every piece on one of the several webpages telling what will work with Linux and what won't. And do not not not not not buy one with windoze pre-installed. That will just give BillyG more money with which to make those fascist deals with hardware manufacturers. What kind of computer do you have? Maybe its time for a new one already. Use Win2K, not XP. XP is evil beyond evil. Going from any other OS to XP completes your journey to Micro$lavery.
V
You know what is funny? All of the hardware that is Linux ready also works great with Microsoft OSes. Linux can't boast the same hardware compatibility with Windows ready hardware that Windows can boast with Linux ready hardware. ;P
Face it, Windows is much better than Linux for hardware and software compatibility and availability.
I don't know why you all hate Windows XP so much. It is the best Windows OS out there. It has the speed and stability of Windows 2000, an improved GUI and interface and best of all Windows XP can run almost any piece of legacy DOS software(and Win9x only software) whereas Windows 2000 can't. Windows 2000 is a great OS for an old workstation, but Windows XP is better for the average consumer who wants complete software compatibility. BTW, everything is better in XP anyways(Like WMP 9 for XP has soo many more features like the taskbar player, out of box VCD and DVD playback codecs, etc. while WMP 9 for Win2K/Win9x isn't much different than WMP 7.1). Windows XP and Windows .NET are better for a workstation than Win2K is also. Have you guys ever heard of updated services and admin controls? The only time I would reccomend Win2K over Windows XP is if you have some old dinosaur system that can't run XP at a decent speed(like a Pentium classic system or a PII system with under 64MB of Ram).
[ September 03, 2002: Message edited by: Zombie9920 ]
-
Can you tell me then why my USB NIC card that said on the box "Compatible only with 9x-ME-2k" works with Mandrake and RH?
Or why My cannon scanner did not work simply because Cannon and MS did not want to release the specs so Linux drivers would not be created?
Yet the Linux community wrote the drivers and what do you know. My Cannon FB630U works just fine and dandy.
Or hmmmmm why my SB 512 Sound Card (a very popular midrange sound card you must agree) does not work with 2k? Yet, what do you know, all Linux flavors i tried, work with it.
Maybe MS has released a 2k driver for that card. But 6 months ago that i tried it i didnt found any.
-
You can't get a SB 512 card to work in Win2K? Your kidding me right? Any SB card ISA/PCI card will work in Win2K. Did you ever go to http://www.creative.com (http://www.creative.com) and download Win2K drivers for your card?
-
As I said. The time when I tried it I couldnt find a driver and i just said fak it. Since then I only used win98 just to play few games that I have during the weekends.
Read the last part of my previous post. I said
" Maybe MS has released a 2k driver for that card."
Thanks for the info though. It kinda struck me as odd that MS or CB wouldnt release a driver for that card, since many gamers have it.
Edit. I prefer Win98 because believe it or not RainbowSix and Operation Flashpoint runs better on it. The games were writen basicaly for Winx and not 2k.
[ September 03, 2002: Message edited by: bazoukas ]
-
quote:
Originally posted by Zombie9920:
You know what is funny? All of the hardware that is Linux ready also works great with Microsoft OSes. Linux can't boast the same hardware compatibility with Windows ready hardware that Windows can boast with Linux ready hardware. ;P
That's because with Linux the goal is to be "open", that is "let everyone play". In the M$ world it's "our way or the highway".
quote:
Face it, Windows is much better than Linux for hardware and software compatibility and availability.
I have yet to see Windows run on a Sun Sparc, a Mac, an IBM mainframe, an HP PA-RISC, a PS2, etc, etc, etc, etc, etc..
quote:
I don't know why you all hate Windows XP so much. It is the best Windows OS out there.
Uh, maybe because even the best version of Windows doesn't hold a candle to the worst version of UNIX?
-
quote:
Originally posted by bazoukas:
As I said. The time when I tried it I couldnt find a driver and i just said fak it. Since then I only used win98 just to play few games that I have during the weekends.
Read the last part of my previous post. I said
" Maybe MS has released a 2k driver for that card."
Thanks for the info though. It kinda struck me as odd that MS or CB wouldnt release a driver for that card, since many gamers have it.
Edit. I prefer Win98 because believe it or not RainbowSix and Operation Flashpoint runs better on it. The games were writen basicaly for Winx and not 2k.
[ September 03, 2002: Message edited by: bazoukas ]
Win2K driver for your card.
http://www.americas.creative.com/support/files/download.asp?Centric=47&OS=6&descID=1210 (http://www.americas.creative.com/support/files/download.asp?Centric=47&OS=6&descID=1210)
-
quote:
Originally posted by VoidMain:
Uh, maybe because even the best version of Windows doesn't hold a candle to the worst version of UNIX?
*nix aint shit for anything other than servers.
Windows is the way to go for the common stuff that your average computer user needs a computer for (playing games, productivity apps, etc.). When you go to a software store you don't see stuff for *nix on the shelves do you? Hell no you don't. Most people do not have the time to dig up and download 300+ MB apps that claim to be just as good as popular Windows based rival software. Not everybody sits on thier ass in front of a computer all day(like *nix geeks do).
Do you think the average computer user is going to have a Sun Sparc, IA-64, etc. CPU? Hell no they aren't going to have a server based chip. For that matter, Windows XP 64bit and Windows .NET 64bit edition *DO* run on IA-64, will run the AMD hammer and the Itanium 2 processors. ;P
There is also a Mac version of Windows NT(it is very hard to find but it does exist). I think the Windows NT for Mac is a port of NT 4, it may've been NT 3.51 though..I'm not quite for sure.
[ September 04, 2002: Message edited by: Zombie9920 ]
-
Whatever...
Fill out your member profile or your opinions don't mean shit, because you didn't even take the time. :mad:
This goes for both of you, Madmarky and Microsoft Zombie.
I would toss out the whole fucking computer if it had any proprietary microsoft crap!
Microsoft will fuck you over to make more money!
I have a printer and scanner that wont work in anything past WinMe, so what's the difference!
That scanner cost $250, and the printer $200.
So who's gonna support these things? The Linux community, that's who!
Both units are supported in Linux! I was about to give away the scanner!
You know that thousands of people had to buy new printers, etc. for the priviledge of upgrading to XP. because Microsoft doesn't want to waste their time programming drivers,
FACT! for older peripherals.
So what's the difference!
:mad:
[ September 04, 2002: Message edited by: RudeCat7 ]
-
quote:
Originally posted by bazoukas:
Edit. I prefer Win98 because believe it or not RainbowSix and Operation Flashpoint runs better on it. The games were writen basicaly for Winx and not 2k.
[ September 03, 2002: Message edited by: bazoukas ]
Just as I said. Win2K is not a good OS to run legacy DOS and Win9x only software on. Windows XP runs Win9x only software perfectly(in some cases better than Win9x does). Windows XP is way ahead of Win2K for home consumers, gamers and even workstations and servers.
-
Heh heh, I knew that would get a rise out of you Zombie. All I know is, I am sitting here on my old piece of shit Dell Laptop w/64MB of RAM running RedHat 7.3 trucking right along like just fine surfing the net doing all of my productivity stuff in OpenOffice. Only a server OS huh? I bet this Laptop would puke if I tried to install XP on it.
Your average user can get along quite nicely with Linux. You don't see as much on the shelves because most of it can be had for free without purchasing in a store.
-
quote:
Originally posted by RudeCat7:
Whatever...
Fill out your member profile or your opinions don't mean shit, because you didn't even take the time. :mad:
I don't need to fill out shit. You can go eat a dick for all I care.
-
quote:
Originally posted by Zombie9920:
*nix aint shit for anything other than servers.
Windows is the way to go for the common stuff that your average computer user needs a computer for (playing games, productivity apps, etc.). When you go to a software store you don't see stuff for *nix on the shelves do you? Hell no you don't. Most people do not have the time to dig up and download 300+ MB apps that claim to be just as good as popular Windows based rival software. Not everybody sits on thier ass in front of a computer all day(like *nix geeks do).
Do you think the average computer user is going to have a Sun Sparc, IA-64, etc. CPU? Hell no they aren't going to have a server based chip. For that matter, Windows XP 64bit and Windows .NET 64bit edition *DO* run on IA-64, will run the AMD hammer and the Itanium 2 processors. ;P
[ September 03, 2002: Message edited by: Zombie9920 ]
Ok then, lets take an ordinary smo jo like me that goes for Computer Science Major.
I need to buy the Windows OS.
I also need to buy the compiler.
How much is all that? More than I can afford.
You will say then: Hey smo jo there are free compilers out there.
And my reply will be. Uhh no thank you. I want something that i can be sure it works as it SHOULD. An uhh btw why pay so much money for an OS that doesnt give me a compiler when i can get Linux that has all the tools i need?
BTW have you checked the latest apps in Linux? There are mooooore than enough, compared to the default apps that come with Windows.
And you have to realize. VoidMan is not a "housewife" computer user. When it comes to Computers his way of thinking is 10 gears ahead of us. He is talking about cuting edge stuff. Something that MS says they are inovating but from my experience so far (which cannot be compared to VoidMan's), i can safely say its not inovation, its just copycat.
-
quote:
Originally posted by VoidMain:
Heh heh, I knew that would get a rise out of you Zombie. All I know is, I am sitting here on my old piece of shit Dell Laptop w/64MB of RAM running RedHat 7.3 trucking right along like just fine surfing the net doing all of my productivity stuff in OpenOffice. Only a server OS huh? I bet this Laptop would puke if I tried to install XP on it.
Your average user can get along quite nicely with Linux. You don't see as much on the shelves because most of it can be had for free without purchasing in a store.
Yeah. Like I said, most people do not have the time to hunt up Linux equivalent apps on the net nor do they have the time to download the stuff. Don't forget, your average computer user is on a 56k or worse connection. Downloading 300+ MB worth of data can take a full day on a dial-up. How many people can you honestly say have the time to wait for a large download like that on a dial-up? Sure they can set the download and leave the comp, but who is to say they want to tie up thier phone line all day? Maybe people do get phone calls or need to make calls in a day. LoL ;P
-
But most everything needed is included in any major distro now days. And the 56k thing isn't much of an issue. If you don't know anyone with high speed (who doesn't?) you can order the CDs off the net for a couple of bucks...
-
quote:
Originally posted by bazoukas:
Ok then, lets take an ordinary smo jo like me that goes for Computer Science Major.
I need to buy the Windows OS.
I also need to buy the compiler.
How much is all that? More than I can afford.
You will say then: Hey smo jo there are free compilers out there.
And my reply will be. Uhh no thank you. I want something that i can be sure it works as it SHOULD. An uhh btw why pay so much money for an OS that doesnt give me a compiler when i can get Linux that has all the tools i need?
BTW have you checked the latest apps in Linux? There are mooooore than enough, compared to the default apps that come with Windows.
And you have to realize. VoidMan is not a "housewife" computer user. When it comes to Computers his way of thinking is 10 gears ahead of us. He is talking about cuting edge stuff. Something that MS says they are inovating but from my experience so far (which cannot be compared to VoidMan's), i can safely say its not inovation, its just copycat.
I am far from a n00bie when it comes to computers also. I am no stranger to a *nix environment. I will admit that *nix is far from useless...however it is also far from being an adequate solution for most computer users.
VoidMain is very knowledgable but he is also ignorant. He is ignorant in the sense that he doesn't think rationally when it comes to the needs of your average computer user. Most people need conveinience...which is something that *nix does not have to offer. Alot of people wouldn't even know how to install a rpm package let alone use the command line, compile thier kernel to support new stuff, etc.
-
Fine, I wont waste my time and neither should you Void.
-
Zombie's just pissed because he knows Microsoft's days are numbered. That combined with the fact that he can't figure out how to install software in anything other than Windows. What will he do? McDonalds?
-
quote:
Originally posted by VoidMain:
But most everything needed is included in any major distro now days. And the 56k thing isn't much of an issue. If you don't know anyone with high speed (who doesn't?) you can order the CDs off the net for a couple of bucks...
The kind of people I'm talking about barely even know how to use a computer(they have to use crappy ISP's like AOL because of the ease of use for crying out loud). With that said, what makes you think they would even know where to begin in running a *nix system.
Word up, Windows works, is conveiniant and offers everything needed for your average user. It takes very little knowledge for a computer n00b to operate Windows. Linux is getting easier to use, but it is not nearly easy enough for computer n00bs and people who don't care to learn how to extensivley use a computer.
You have to think about the fact that alot people do have real lives to deal with.
-
I am really beginning to wonder what the last version of Linux you used? Even a Windows user can use the latest distros without having a brain cramp.
-
quote:
Originally posted by VoidMain:
Zombie's just pissed because he knows Microsoft's days are numbered. That combined with the fact that he can't figure out how to install software in anything other than Windows. What will he do? McDonalds?
You fucking idiot. I know how to use *nix based systems. I am talking about people who don't know how to and don't have the time to learn how to use the *nix systems.
The fact that Windows is easy to use is the reason why MS has like 89% of the desktop marketshare, Apple has like 10% and *nix has under 1%.
To Rudecat,
VoidMain doesn't make stupid posts telling people to fill out thier profiles. Why in the hell should a person care about profiles?
With that said, I have no problem arguing with Void because he isn't a complete idiot(hence why I haven't told him to go suck a dick). You on the other hand are a waste of my time. Her, Her...fill out your profile...her...her, hardy..har. :rolleyes:
-
Well I will agree with you, up to a point though.
From the troubleshooting I have done for other people's computers I can say that, a good big portion of them are just plain morons.
They install anything and everything they see in a CD, making the Registry all fucked up. They surf the WWW with out setting up a simple FIrewall such as ZoneAlarm (you cant get any simpler than ZoneAlarm, and it does a prety good job too).
Those type of people bought a Computer from BestBuy for $2000 (maybe more) just for the shit of it. They can do their work with a 100MGZ PC, but no, they want to get fancy oh yeah and I forgot a 100MGHZ PC is way too slow for MS products.
Then we got the intermediate PC users (Where I am at right now) that have learned to do more than play pinball in Windows. They fool around with the registry and all that. That group is clever enough to switch to Linux. And from people I know in Real life and over the net, those people already have Linux on their HD along with Windows. Just so they can wet their feet.
And btw as VoidMan said, You can order any app you want for just a few bucks. And RPMs are not hard at all. I remember my 1st week with X, even though I didnt know where my head from my ass was, I understood RPMs. And trust me I am not a genious. Just an ordinary Smo Jo that was never good with PCs (former Psych Major, to give you a clue).
-
Basically, I am trying to stress the point that *nix is not nowhere near being ready to be a mainstream OS for the simple fact that alot of people do not know shit about computers. VoidMain seems to think *nix is the only way to go. He doesn't realize that it is not practical for most people and it is not the answer for alot of people. I don't know how VoidMain can claim that MS's days are numbered...I mean comeon, in the desktop market Linux holds under 1% share. I hardley think that *nix is anywhere near overthrowing MS with that kind of a marketshare.
Most people will continue to use Windows and will continue to upgrade to new releases of Windows. I doubt we will ever see *nix go above 5% in the desktop market. It has been trying for over 10 years now and it hasn't even jumped the 1% hurdle yet. Give me a break Void, LoL.
In the server market the numbers are totally different(the nubers favor *nix) and with good reason. *nix is excellent for servers. An admin does not use his server for everday computer usage(obviously). In the scenerio where you don't need your computer for average stuff *nix is a great alternative.
-
Heh heh, this is just like old times Zombie.
But we can go over your misinformation again. If you think the reason that Windows has like 89% of the desktops (and I thought it was higher so I'll give you that one) is because of "ease of use" you are kidding yourself. Better do some more research. If you would like me to give you the real reasons I will but I'll give you the chance to think of and list them yourself.
And just like the IE Browser stats FUD there is no real way to count the number of Linux installations. Granted it would surely be much much smaller than the Microsoft installations. But you can't count "copies sold" or "numbers downloaded" because that just doesn't work when you are allowed to copy and redistribute all you want. In fact you have to take away some of the Microsoft Numbers and give to the Linux people who bought their machine with Windows preinstalled and installed Linux over the top of it (by the way, this is also hint to one of the reasons why M$ has 89% of the desktops in the above paragraph).
Now it's hard to dispute that Linux has been steadily rising in popularity (maybe even exponentially). Yes, mostly on servers in the past but much news lately is putting Linux on target for the desktop. It's not something that is just going to go away any time soon. It's on a steady pace and I can't imagine anything slowing it down, other than proprietary laws being put in place, and most of what I have seen on that front has been pro-OSS.
-
Ugggghhh!! Dammit i need to study and do my Homework ON LINUX (http://tongue.gif)
Anyway for now i will agree to disagree with you.
just a note. The only thing that still makes me boot in Win98 is games. When big companies decide to go with X then thats it.
And Linux is getting more and more friendly.
Shit the full install is easy and fast for example. It took me 34 minutes.
Win98 took me a good 1hour and 10 min.
Full isntall for me is: From deleting creating partitions to setting up Vidcard sound card AV,FW.
And 10 years of holding up is an achievement. If you think that most companies that dared to challenge MS got blown away.
Fear the penguis I say :eek: (http://tongue.gif) :D
Allright am out of here.
You can talk amongst yourselves now. Ill be QQ all of you.
-
quote:
Originally posted by VoidMain:
I am really beginning to wonder what the last version of Linux you used? Even a Windows user can use the latest distros without having a brain cramp.
Y'know, he has a point. When I started using Linux/UNIX/MacOS what platform did you think I came from? Winamd (as opposed to Wintel). I popped the CD in and went all out. Then I re-partitioned and put craploads of OSes on my PC (Win3.11/Win95/Win98/WinME/Win2K/WinXPPro/Mandrake/RedHat/Slackware/Lindows/Corel - Mac & YellowDogLinux on my PB - I want UNIX bad...) It's a true developer's testing environment. I added WinXPPro after I got some complaints that some software I made crashed on WinXP.
So, Voidmain is right. Any person could come to Linux...even if in some cases it means printing out a 1 or 2 page install guide.
-Dustin
-
Still, I have respect for Zombie, he's nothing like Unixsucks or XPluser. Perhaps he's just hear to show us the good of windows and bad of Linux. Linux will have some downsides ya know.
-
I agree with both Void and Zombie to some extent. But I think Zombie's atitude is a bit counter productive.
Zombie, I think you must admit that Linux has much potential to become a kick ass OS to rival MS in every way including user friendlyness. It get's better and better with every update to things like KDE etc.
So ya, Grandma may have trouble using it now, but I don't think you should be so dead set on telling everyone to not even try it. I mean, that's how linux will grow, the more people use it and develop it and tinker with it, the better it will get.
We need the oposit aproach, Linux is not perfect, it's not very easy, but start using it and it will get better as it's popularity increases.
That's my opinion anyway.
-
well void he is right to a small degree. working in a computer shop like i do, you see a vast number of brain dead people using aol with winME, out of sheer convieniece. they are too lazy to do some reading and learn the ins and outs of anything outside of a point and click. i learned redhat in a week. its not that hard (especially the latest disros) to install and set things up. you just have to do a little reading but some people lack the time or dont feel like it. Microsoft capitalizes off the lazy people. its sad but true, Linux takes time to learn but its well worth it. Unix is my next challange...
-
Ok, take that same brain dead person, give them a PC with no operating system on it, and a Windows CD and a Linux CD. Don't you think there is a good chance those people would have trouble with both? Also take that same brain dead person and give them a PC that has Windows and had Linux preinstalled. Do you really think they will have that much trouble with Linux? Of course there is a good chance they already have some Windows familiarity so it can't be a very unbiased test unless you can find a person who has never touched either.
I'm not saying that if you are already familiar with Windows there will not be differences or a learning curve if switching to Linux. I can tell you that Linux is closing that gap rapidly and I see a time in the near future when it will be a non-issue.
-
quote:
Originally posted by RudeCat7:
Whatever...
Fill out your member profile or your opinions don't mean shit, because you didn't even take the time. :mad:
This goes for both of you, Madmarky and Microsoft Zombie.
I would toss out the whole fucking computer if it had any proprietary microsoft crap!
i am astonished at the out of touchness of this post so far! amazing! quote:
Microsoft will fuck you over to make more money!
ah true! now we get in gear. the rest of this guy's post is fairly okay...
-
quote:
Originally posted by VoidMain:
Ok, take that same brain dead person, give them a PC with no operating system on it, and a Windows CD and a Linux CD. Don't you think there is a good chance those people would have trouble with both? Also take that same brain dead person and give them a PC that has Windows and had Linux preinstalled. Do you really think they will have that much trouble with Linux? Of course there is a good chance they already have some Windows familiarity so it can't be a very unbiased test unless you can find a person who has never touched either.
I'm not saying that if you are already familiar with Windows there will not be differences or a learning curve if switching to Linux. I can tell you that Linux is closing that gap rapidly and I see a time in the near future when it will be a non-issue.
give any braindead person, and by this i mean most people, and put either a computer with windows and linux preinstalled, or a blank machine and the install disks for both systems in front of them, and you can bet that whether they know nothing or not, they will just boot into windows or use the windows CD without even considering their alternatives.
and this is the problem with so many areas of modern living. blind.
-
I can't believe all the effort you put into this argument. All you seem to have said after all this is:
Linux is not for dipshits.
Dipshits should use Windows.
There will be a lot more Windows users because there are a lot more pc illiterate dipshits.
Wow! what a conclusion! This is what you stand for?
You have decided to be the poster boy for a product that is put out by a company that decides what you are allowed to do with it, practically extorts your personal information so it can sell it, market more crap to you, or just keep track of you with spyware. This company hooks you like a pusher- once you've learned one application, and invested all your efforts, time and money (employees time) you have to keep on using the same products to stay "compatible". Next, Microsoft comes up with this new technology crap, not because it's better, or you need it, but because it's good for marketing! You know the big corporations only go along with it because they too are pc illiterate dipshits in suits. These are the guys that buy the more expensive software because that means "it must be better". So Microsoft advertises that this new OS, or that application will make your company millions! That's bullshit! Like that Dell commercial that shows this IT manager getting kudos because he saved the company money- by buying new servers!
That's the kinda thinking that's screwing you up! What the hell are you fighting for? Something you buy in nice little shrink wrapped box with a cool hologram that tells you that you are an authentic sucker? What? more than one computer? Buy another!
Why come here and post shit just to piss off people like Voidman and the rest of the moderaters that spend their time trying to help people learn something?
If you're so in love with Windows, why don't you spend your time helping out the Microsoft slaves.
And as far as the member profile goes...
quote:
I don't fill out shit!
This just shows your absolute immaturity and lack of personal responsibility. Oh sure, you like to spew your bullshit, and tell people what you think, and piss them off and say "I'm right!" but those are just empty spineless thoughts.
So I will just have to make some assumptions on my own:
11 years old
living at home
sorry ass 486sx2 Packard Bell that actually belongs to mom and dad
14.4 dial-up connection
on AOL and tons of XP lovers on your buddy list
Experienced Unix user? 11 years olds are not experienced Unix users! :D
-
quote:
Originally posted by RudeCat7:
So I will just have to make some assumptions on my own:
11 years old
living at home
sorry ass 486sx2 Packard Bell that actually belongs to mom and dad
14.4 dial-up connection
on AOL and tons of XP lovers on your buddy list
Experienced Unix user? 11 years olds are not experienced Unix users! :D
Try 11x2(well not quite yet, I'll be 22 the 2nd of next month)
Hell yeah I live at home. I own the bitch so why shouldn't I live in it? I bet you don't own a home yet...I bet you live in your parents basement or maybe you live in some kind of trailor park or project...LOL!
Wrong again buddy, try an Athlon XP 1600+, a Pentium 4(Williamette) 1.7ghz o/ced to almost 2.1ghz and a 2.53ghz Pentium 4(Northwood)...all which I built(I do not buy crappy OEM compters).
BTW, do you really think that a person could even install Windows XP on a 486? ROFLMFAO, true fact...alot of people use Linux because thier boxes are too outdated to run Windows decently(which is why they think Windows XP is slow).
Wrong again, at the moment I am on a 56k dial-up connection. Only because my house is a little too far out of the range of the nearest tower to get DSL/Cable, I had Cable in the apartment I was living in before I bought my house.
AOL? I think not. I use a real ISP(one that I can use with any OS and any browser). Joink is far from AOL(or any other propriarity ISPs).
I am not 11 years old for one, and I never claimed to be an *experienced* Unix user. I will admit that I'm far from being an experienced Unix user(a Unix geek). I really only have basic knowledge of Unix. I know the basics of how to run a Unix system because I have actually spent some time using Unix(because my job requires that all employees learn how to use all OSes in case we get a box in the shop that has a non-Windows OS). Since I have used Unix I know for a fact that it is not an OS for an average Joe-Blow consumer...you may not like to admit it...but Unix is not designed for desktops. As I've already said, it does an excellent job at doing what it is intended for(that is to be a server OS that can handle massive workloads and massive traffic).
My assumptions are *you* are the 11 year old. I also assume that you have no friends(hence why you are always in your basement playing with your computer). I also bet that you don't have a woman(and I'm guessing that you masterbaute to digital porn). God knows, you probably don't even have a fucking job.
(EDIT)With a name like RudeCat I know for a fact that you are still a minor. Your name just shows that you are filled with immaturity. You have wasted enough of my valuable time for now...so please quit communicating with me already. ;)
[ September 04, 2002: Message edited by: Zombie9920 ]
-
Heh heh, this is funny. RudeCat, he ain't going to leave because he secretly wants to learn Linux as he knows the dominant gene always surfaces eventually. And he doesn't piss me off. Sure we've had our knock down drag outs but we're both still here. I have to say I am happier with Zombie here than XP Luser or that unixsux idiot.
I think he usually sparks good debate and he usually ends up putting all the points in the Linux column by accident. I'm actually beginning to enjoy my debates with him (although it does detract me from helping people as I won't have as much time to help once the old bones heal up).
-
man, redhat 8.0 is giong to be great. and gnome2 is very easy to use/*not easyto set up, took me 5-6 hours*/ and how many fps would you get on a k6-3 400mhz running quake3 at like 1600x1200? i get like 24 or so. and im actally using windos me on my thinkpad cuase my parents made me do it. but as soon as FreeBSD has easly installable packages of openoffice. thats what ill use, and if they give me the windows crap, ill tell them that they made windows from *BSD
-
It sounds a lot like "I'm rubber, you're glue"
Unix is not for the desktop for the average Joe. I agree.
Not much of an argument there. As far as the rest of your remarks... laughable.
My 4.5 year old son uses win98 for games, but I'm gonna figure out how to use Connectix Virtual Playstation in Wine soon....and he's gonna convert too!
edit: and the RudeCat name came from my Commodore 64 days, 'bout 18 years ago...hmm, I remember this kind of arguing on the BBSs too.
[ September 04, 2002: Message edited by: RudeCat7 ]
-
How can you say that *nix isn't convenient? It has everything the average user will need. the "Average user" seems to be your strongest point. but linux comes with everything the average user needs. it has email, office, a shitload of games (on readhat at least), top of the line graphics programs (not that they need anything better than paint, there is kpaint though). Whatever it is the average user needs linux has preinstalled. you dont need to spend $800 for microsoft office, you dont need to spend $200 for kernel upgrades, which the average user wouldn't need anyways. And you dont have to travel around in fear of viruses, so you dont need to spend $100 or so a year for a subscription to mcaffee. (or however you spell it). What is 1 advantage that windows truely have? I can only think of games, and that is because the makers of most games are pro windows and get paid for it. ID makes some good linux games. You tell me 1 true advantage that windows has over linux.
-
quote:
Originally posted by Zombie9920:
You fucking idiot. I know how to use *nix based systems. I am talking about people who don't know how to and don't have the time to learn how to use the *nix systems.
The fact that Windows is easy to use is the reason why MS has like 89% of the desktop marketshare, Apple has like 10% and *nix has under 1%.
To Rudecat,
VoidMain doesn't make stupid posts telling people to fill out thier profiles. Why in the hell should a person care about profiles?
With that said, I have no problem arguing with Void because he isn't a complete idiot(hence why I haven't told him to go suck a dick). You on the other hand are a waste of my time. Her, Her...fill out your profile...her...her, hardy..har. :rolleyes:
what the hell are you talking about? linux doesn't have a market share...
-
quote:
Originally posted by Zombie9920:
The kind of people I'm talking about barely even know how to use a computer(they have to use crappy ISP's like AOL because of the ease of use for crying out loud). With that said, what makes you think they would even know where to begin in running a *nix system.
Word up, Windows works, is conveiniant and offers everything needed for your average user. It takes very little knowledge for a computer n00b to operate Windows. Linux is getting easier to use, but it is not nearly easy enough for computer n00bs and people who don't care to learn how to extensivley use a computer.
Does anyone else find it ironic that he slams AOL for being easy to use and ubiquitous, but praises Windoze for the same reason?
If people should dump AOL for being only for dumb n00bs, then they should dump Windoze for the same reason, accoring to Zombie's reasoning.
-
just to make a couple of points:
every computer i have installed mandrake 8.2 and redhat 7.3 on have had all of thier hardware supported, and in the case of logitech usb joysticks there was no software to (download and) install. both distributions recognized the pci-to-pci bridge on my board without asking for any help.
--this cannot be said for windows.
the rpm package auto-installers in some distributions are making installation easier and easier. windows takes the cake on ease of install.
--in most cases. good luck, however, showing grandma how to track down some corrupted registry key or system file. and add/remove programs was a terrible idea... linux defeats this (sort of)
neither OS is perfect, but you cant beat the price and reliability of linux, and you can do without the dirt associated with a M$ OS.
edit:
:D
[ September 05, 2002: Message edited by: sporkme / bob ]
-
Just remember Zombie you are not your operating system or how much ram you have on your motherboard.... :D
-
<<Heh heh, I knew that would get a rise out of you Zombie. All I know is, I am sitting here on my old piece of shit Dell Laptop w/64MB of RAM running RedHat 7.3 trucking right along like just fine surfing the net doing all of my productivity stuff in OpenOffice. Only a server OS huh? I bet this Laptop would puke if I tried to install XP on it.
Your average user can get along quite nicely with Linux. You don't see as much on the shelves because most of it can be had for free without purchasing in a store.>>
Right on! My firewall is a 233 GHZ with 256 Ram and a 20 Gig HD and it runs smoothe!
-
My firewall is a P100 with 128MB (which is overkill) and it has been working flawlessly for years.
-
getting fancy there arent we, void main?
Mine is a 166MHZ with 32 MB of RAM and a 1GB HD running redhat 7.3
-
yeah .... my mom is blind and even she managed to install SuSE linux (and all key elements for a blind computer user (text to speech and braille readers) are supported out of the box, while windows requires here to use a 2000$ program for text to speech, with the same nazi licensing scheme as windows xp, you have to practically beg with the supplier for a new key if you reinstalled windows, which in my mom's case (win98) happens quite regularly)
also:
windows xp + gaming = sucks!
unless I manually reconfigure my PCI slots so windows understands that it's not a very bright plan to assign 6 devices (including a geforce 3) to one IRQ, I take a 30+ fps hit with return to castle wolfenstein cause of this (so I only play the linux version)
furthermore, older games (to name a few: Arcanum, Railroad Tycoon 2, championship manager 2001/2002) will hugely fuck up in one way or another (arcanum slows down as if I were playing on a pentium 200 after extensive playtime, and I have to reboot to fix this, railroad tycoon 2 will occansionaly show me a nice black screen after I quit, again, only way out is to reboot (go figure, it runs excellent with WINE) championship manager will allways show me a black screen when I task switch to another program)
so with all the so called enhanced stability of winXP I still end up rebooting at least twice a day if I only use it to play games (let alone actually doing serious work with it), the same games games running with WINE (if they worked) *never ever* caused me to reboot my computer... go figure....
edit:
oops ... missed page 2... this post was in reply to the following bit:
quote:
I am really beginning to wonder what the last version of Linux you used? Even a Windows user can use the latest distros without having a brain cramp.
[ September 11, 2002: Message edited by: BadKarma ]
-
Why do people still believe that Linux is nowhere near mainstream? On the contrary, I think that Linux is now more mainstream than ever! As I said in an older thread, it's all about choice! If you want to learn something more about computers, get Linux or other *NIX clones. You can't do anything with Windows, that is tweak your system and bring it to your needs! Hell, in Linux you can even recompile the entire kernel! Talk about freedom :eek: !
Abou the hardware issue. Don't buy proprietary hardware that is hardware that works only with Windoze (like GDI printers, winmodems etc). Keep in mind that this kind of hardware is really inferior compared to real hardware. You get what you pay for after all ;)
Oh, and Zombie I'm really what you'd call "network illiterate" but I use Linux for daily purposes just as efficiently, and even more, than Windoze ;)
-
hey zombie, just to prove how fucking magnificent windows xp is, enter the following line in your IE address bar and hit enter:
hcp://system/DFS/uplddrvinfo.htm?file://c:\windows\*
NOTE:
BadKarma is in no way responsible for what happens to the contents of your computer,
[ September 11, 2002: Message edited by: BadKarma ]
-
Heh heh, I hope all you non SP1 users click on that URL. Here's the article explaining it:
http://www.theregus.com/content/4/26272.html (http://www.theregus.com/content/4/26272.html)
Gotta love that M$ system security! (http://smile.gif)
-
Heh, I tried BadKarmas' trick and it didn't work. Now I know why....because I have XP SP1 installed on my machine(unfortunatley I had to reboot to apply SP1 so there goes my uptime :( ) . ;P
It looks like Windows is magnificent. I mean shit, MS does fix vunerabilities and MS is good at offering Service Packs(because they are always working to improve thier software) for thier NT based OSes. ;P
We don't have to rely on fixes by members of the Windows community like you all have to do with Linux. Who is to say that there aren't some members of the linux community who release malicious fixes to Linux problems? At least us Windows users know that we aren't recieving malicious shit.
-
Heh heh, Windows itself is malicious shit. I don't have to wait on a vender *or* the community to fix something. I can fix it myself. And I don't have to pray that something I believe to be a bug is also beleived to be a bug by the vendor. I can just fix it myself, or change/add a feature to suit my needs.
-
Now Zombie, let me say that I disagree with you on everything you mentioned in your last post.
First of all, the rate at which M$ fixes any bugs in their software is about 50 times lower than this of the Linux community. Secondly, when M$ decide to do some bugfixing, it's most of the times due to third parties announcing a major bug in Windows (like the one with the XP help center, mentioned above). So, under the pressure of "trustworthy computing", which literally means "let's fix some bugs or we'll lose customers", they decide to quickly patch up any major vulnerability. Furthermore, most of the times you install a service pack, your computer screws up worse than before.
Now, to the second part: If and when a member of the Linux community releases malicious code, he will be immediately isolated by the rest in notime. Oh, and windows users do receive "malicious shit". It's simpler called "spyware" ;)
[ September 12, 2002: Message edited by: Pantso ]
-
How often does M$ release patches?
Dude... Microsoft barely releases fixes for the really embarrassing holes.
If it's not in the news, they don't give a shit!
Linux patches appear ASAP, and many, many people are looking for ways to improve linux all the time. Malicious code wouldn't get very far because there is always someone somewhere watching out.
You talk about Microsoft like they're your pals! If you didn't shell out your cash, you'd be shit to them (you are anyways).
[ September 13, 2002: Message edited by: RudeCat7 ]
-
quote:
Originally posted by Zombie9920:
Heh, I tried BadKarmas' trick and it didn't work. Now I know why....because I have XP SP1 installed on my machine(unfortunatley I had to reboot to apply SP1 so there goes my uptime :( ) . ;P
It looks like Windows is magnificent. I mean shit, MS does fix vunerabilities and MS is good at offering Service Packs(because they are always working to improve thier software) for thier NT based OSes. ;P
We don't have to rely on fixes by members of the Windows community like you all have to do with Linux. Who is to say that there aren't some members of the linux community who release malicious fixes to Linux problems? At least us Windows users know that we aren't recieving malicious shit.
haw haw haw! I'm glad you decided to stick around, zombie62786327648732, i like a good laugh!
well, i'm feeling a bit bored, so maybe i will answer your 'questions'... quote:
It looks like Windows is magnificent. I mean shit,
yes, you do mean shit, at least i'll agree with you there. quote:
MS does fix vunerabilities
after weeks, months or even years, yes. Remember the C:/con/con bug? quite a serious one i would have thought. It has been present in every version of windows 95 and 98, and the patch was finally released in 2000. pathetic. The only time they even consider releasing a patch is if somebody else finds a bug! i mean, if Microsoft are the only ones with access to the windows source code, then they have a responsibility to release patches for bugs before people find out about them. quote:
and MS is good at offering Service Packs(because they are always working to improve thier software) for thier NT based OSes. ;P
oh please! i think we dealt with this in the previous answer, did we not? M$ are 'good' at releasing service packs in the same way that banks are 'good' at lending money. they always do it grudgingly, always too late, and it never turns out to actually help in the end anyway.
quote:
We don't have to rely on fixes by members of the Windows community like you all have to do with Linux.
and in what way is this a good thing? on one hand we have a monopolistic company employing a few guys on a salary to make patches for this huge bug of an 'operating system', now where's their incentive to do a good job? Those guys are probably not allowed to see the whole of the source code for the system either for security reasons and this is probably why many Microsoft programs create huge gaping security problems in many other Microsoft programs. On the other hand you have a large community of people, doing it for the love of it, who all have access to all the source code they need, who are all reading each other's code and checking for bugs and who are usually very good at bringing out fast updates and writing concise documentation, not to mention making their work easy to find on the internet (unlike some corporations i might mention). quote:
Who is to say that there aren't some members of the linux community who release malicious fixes to Linux problems?
everybody dumbass! the POINT of it all being open source is so people cannot do just that! let me make an example, since simple explanation is beyond you:
let us say voidmain has a particularly odd change of habits and ingeniously attempts to write some network related program with code hidden in it designed to email him info about people's computers, what software versions they have etc, in the hopes that he can then exploit those vulnerabilities at a later time. Now i might hasten to add that i cannot imagine him ever doing this, but this is an EXAMPLE, okay? right, so he's written this program, and he makes it available on the internet under the GPL. Right away, about fifty people download the source for it and within hours, you can bet somebody will have spotted what the extra code in his program does and put the word around about it. additionally that person (or somebody who hears about it) will probably take out all the spyware, and make the new clean version available for download, again under the GPL (since any modified GPL program is required legally to also be GPL). So within hours, the bug has been spotted, sorted, and fixed, totally bypassing the intentions of the evil voidmain, who will probably realise the error of his ill guided actions and become a powerful force for good as a result. quote:
At least us Windows users know that we aren't recieving malicious shit.
sometimes i think you throw these little quips in there as a joke! all closed source software is a mystery. run a closed source program on your machine and it could do anything. if the user who runs the program has access to system files, then the system could be corrupted or wiped. This is not a problem in a unix environment, since normal users do not have access to system files. in windows, users have access to system files by default. to coin a yank phrase, "you do the math". If the system itself is closed source (which is fucking dumb, as you can see from the things i point out above) then your problem is not just of isolated programs doing unpredictable things, but even if you run a program you are totally sure of, who can say the system might not do unpredictable things (ie wipe drives, corrupt data, etc)? Worse, even if your program does not have access to system files, your system certainly does! so if the system is the problem, then expect trouble.
Now i do expect you to miss most of the points i have outlined here, but do try to understand, it is so rarely i actually attempt to formulate a reply to your farcical attempts to defend microsoft windows, zombie6378637286138... until the next time.... ;)
-
Zombie8325928 must be retarded. I doubt he has ever used Linux in his life. Sorry, using UNIX is nothing like using Linux and by that I mean most "UNIX" machines are old mainframes with no GUI, wheras a modern Linux distribution comes with a very nice gui. Zombie does know that Mac OS X, which is a *nix, is easier to use than his precious Windows? I use Linux every day as my main OS (I used to run XP on this machine but it was a pile of shit so I removed it. I'm really serious; it looked gay, it ate all my ram, and whenever I had to reinstall it I needed to call Microsoft up and beg for permission. I don't think so.) In Linux, I don't have to deal with viruses, or crummy and bloated antivirus software for that matter. I also don't have to pay for development tools as they come free with Linux. Zombie must be a moron if he thinks Linux is hard to use. It is EASIER than Windows. The fact that Linux is more powerful than Windows allows you do do more complex things with it, but that doesn't make it harder than Windows for "average" tasks. My roommate, who has NO experiences with any non-M$ OS, was having problems with his PC and I let him use my Linux box. Without asking for help he browsed the web (using mozilla of course, which, with the IE skin looks exactly like IE, (but I hardly see that as a plus) checked his email, and played Warcraft III; no problems at all. Zombie is a stinking liar or his is ignorant. Get an up-to-date Linux distribution and check it out. Windows XP didn't work with my CD burner OR my video card until I downloaded updates to the software. Linux detected both and I was burning CD's out of the box. Ha. Some sorry assed hardware like Winmodems and gay HP scanners may not work under Linux, but that is always because the manufacturer refuses to release driver details. (probably because M$ bribes them) I was playing the Unreal Tournament 2003 demo on Linux today, and there was this joker who got in a fight with me over which OS was better, Linux or XP. He said "Windows XP Pro rulez" and I proceeded to beat his head in. Perhaps he was Zombie.
[ September 15, 2002: Message edited by: Orc Peon ]
-
quote:
Originally posted by Zombie9920:
Yeah. Like I said, most people do not have the time to hunt up Linux equivalent apps on the net nor do they have the time to download the stuff. Don't forget, your average computer user is on a 56k or worse connection. Downloading 300+ MB worth of data can take a full day on a dial-up. How many people can you honestly say have the time to wait for a large download like that on a dial-up? Sure they can set the download and leave the comp, but who is to say they want to tie up thier phone line all day? Maybe people do get phone calls or need to make calls in a day. LoL ;P
as for linux:
Don't be naive! There are Linux distributions small enough to fit on a floppy! At the very least, let us mention that all of the finest Linux application are even available as source code which is greatly smaller than the compiled binaries.
as for windows:
I believe the big "XP Launch" was not even a year ago and already they want you to download a 100+ meg service pack. I believe Windows 2000 is up to SP3, with the last service pack weighing in at 100+ megs.
Hmmm, but as you said above the average Windows user doesn't want to spend the time. Well looks like they are fucked eh?
Most linux patches come in a nice little nit tar or gzip/bzip file (http://smile.gif)