Stop Microsoft
All Things Microsoft => Microsoft Software => Topic started by: avid007 on 19 October 2002, 06:02
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Everyone,
Let me start by saying I am fully prepared to get flamed, but I don't care. When I refer to Linux, I am speaking of the use of the OS as a desktop (not server).
I have been around computers for long enough to conisder myself oldschool. I tried Linux in 1995 dual booting with 3.11, and it was a shitty experience. It took a lot of work to get the "drivers" working...I am being sarcastic.
Anyway, Linux is way better now, I know that. But, what is the point?
Money rules everything, money comes from business, business uses Windows. My mom would never know how to use Linux. The applications that come out for Linux can't compete with the R&D/Marketing budgets of the companies coming out with Windows Apps.
The only shot Linux has is as a server. It is free and good. That is fine, but it doesn't work with everything, can't authenticate Windows against it. No solid AD structure.
Also, all the other apps that MS will win with. IE will always be the browser of choice, Windows Media Server is free, so Real is royally screwed. Office...etc...
So, stay with Linux if you want, but it will never ever ever be the desktop OS of choice, so don't waste your time with the fight you can't win.
-avid007
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So be fully prepared that we don't care.
Read the sig, live your life.
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quote:
Originally posted by RudeCat7:
So be fully prepared that we don't care.
Read the sig, live your life.
I second that... and we should care what you think because??
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Welcome to the forums avid007. now, Fuck off.
(http://www.sederquistavery.com/roy/images/fuckoff.jpg)
[ October 18, 2002: Message edited by: xyle_one ]
[ October 23, 2002: Message edited by: xyle_one ]
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So you're argument is that because you have to pay for windows, and windows apps, it is better? Linux hasn't really had a budget, as anyone can work on it. But yet it has surpassed windows in every aspect i can think of, with the exception of perhaps simplicity. You are telling me that because I have to pay $200 for a dumbed down, feature restricted, unethical operating system, it is better. As for simplicity I think redhat is going down that road too, and when they have it so it is easy enough for any windows user you'll find the windows popluation slowly declining. This won't be long. When palladium comes around i'm sure 80% of people will switch to an alternate operating system, as they want their music, movies, and other non-palladium stuff.
But then again, they have a big budget, they must be better. :rolleyes:
Why would you waste your time posting where you know you'll only waste people like me's time?
[ October 18, 2002: Message edited by: Stryker ]
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I'll respond to this the same as I responded to your other post. I have already beat Microsoft. My house is Microsoft free. My kids use OpenOffice to do their homework, they use Mozilla or Konqueror to browse the web, they use Evolution to read their mail. My parents have no trouble using it and I don't have to clean viruses off of their computer every time I visit ever since I set them up with Linux. I use Linux exclusively in my business. So now why should I care about Microsoft again?
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quote:
Originally posted by void main:
I'll respond to this the same as I responded to your other post. I have already beat Microsoft. My house is Microsoft free. My kids use OpenOffice to do their homework, they use Mozilla or Konqueror to browse the web, they use Evolution to read their mail. My parents have no trouble using it and I don't have to clean viruses off of their computer every time I visit ever since I set them up with Linux. I use Linux exclusively in my business. So now why should I care about Microsoft again?
Because this is an anti-microsoft site, we are here to care. Me, I care but i don't care positively about them.
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avid007, I'm one of the only people here who thinks Microsoft actually makes a good product (for home use, anyway) and even I don't believe that Microsoft is invulnerable, monopoly though it may be. Fact is, Steve Ballmer has publicly made it clear that Linux is the most worrisome problem Microsoft has ever faced. Since it isn't a company, more of a phenomenon, none of Microsoft's tactics seem to work on it. To think, people giving software away for free??!?? Steve can barely comprehend the notion itself, although he is beginning to pretend to cozy up to the idea, even going so far as to say he "loves open source." For him I imagine it's like cuddling up in bed with a pit viper. Before Linux came on the scene, the idea that people would actually give away software to combat Microsoft hadn't entered into even his darkest thoughts. After using some of the later versions of Linux myself, I have a feeling that Microsoft, and Apple for that matter, should be very wary of its progress. It only takes a couple of extra steps, and bam! No more proprietary operating systems. So, in my opinion, Microsoft is not invulnerable, even on the desktop. All they need to do is get complacent or make one wrong move (palladium, perhaps?) and it's over for them. I think it's great, since now we have something that will drive Microsoft to make even better products than it already does, and so even though it may stay around it will be stronger in the long run because of things like Linux.
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Don't get me wrong...I think healthy competition is always good...(economics), however, I see no chance at all that Linux can compete. Honestly, all the cool anti-microsoft Linux shit and then what does RedHat do?
SO don't think for a second that you are helping some....cause. You are just helping someone else get rich. Meanwhile, everyone else uses Windows and is happy to pay their fees becuase the software works. It isn't a hack every time I want to do something. If I have a problem, the answers are easily available and I don't have to be a rocket scientist to figure it out.
Remember an OS is not going to succeed if it is cool for geeks and programmers (unless it is a server). An OS succeeds if it is easy to use and works with everyone else COMPATIBILITY (sorry Macintosh)
Really, what is the point? If you are seeking careers as programmers or sys admins, then keep up with Linux because you'll make big bucks. But if you think you are helping some cause, you are just fattening someone elses wallet.
And if your Mom is using Linux, then something is wrong with your family!!!
-avid007
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quote:
Originally posted by avid007:
SO don't think for a second that you are helping some....cause. You are just helping someone else get rich. Meanwhile, everyone else uses Windows and is happy to pay their fees becuase the software works.
I have NEVER had to get any security updates for open office, star office, evolution, or any other standard program that most users would be using. If for some reason I did wish to get a security update, nowhere would I ever be forced to give personal information, or have it secretly taken from me. With Windows I have had windows itself continously pester me with "automatic updates" which basicly says, "This operating system is extremely vulnerable to security breaches, because of this we will be bothering you until you submit personal information and get our updates. Whereas we will then go to bother you even more in the near future." Yes you can turn off automatic updates, but would any normal person figure that out? By normal I mean someone who gets on, types a report, checks email, and plays solitaire. Gates even says that his operating system has no flaws, but then they still want you to get updates? What the fuck? Sure, "It just works" :rolleyes: But why would you want to go through that when you can have a system that works right out of the box, and is free or next to free?
As for economics... It's Microsoft, they don't really have to worry about money too much. Unless of course someone else is getting some, or nobody at all. My first experience with linux I remember because of it's ease. It installed flawlessly, and the only reason I post questions here is because I want to go beyond what the standard windows user would like. (Like finding a rhino alternative). Which I have found a few things I am looking into right now.
You come on here and say that we are wasting our time for a cause that doesn't exist. What is it that you think you are doing here?
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And then what does Redhat do... no seriously Avid, I don't know what Redhat did. I can still download Redhat for free from their site, what did they do?
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>>You come on here and say that we are wasting our time for a cause that doesn't exist. What is it that you think you are doing here?
I am simply getting on your nerves because you know I am right. Plus, I was bored tonight.
>>I don't know what Redhat did. I can still download Redhat for free from their site, what did they do?
You know exactly what they did. They sold the fuck out! Go to a Linux conference...ask anybody who has been here a while. It ain't techy cool anymore. It's all business now. All the causers just contributed to the wallets of someone else.
You know that is true. Let anybody tell me that Linux conferences aren't all business now.
I'm just saying know who you are working for.
-avid007
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Lesser of two evils, Avid. Free and corporate, or proprietary and corporate. IF Redhat counts as evil...
To save the world and kill Microsoft, you have to team up with former enemies(the corps). Although I have some theories about this:
1)How do you know that ALL Linux conferences are like this, some perhaps, but all?
2)Maybe some geeks just wear suits to fit in with the corps.
3)Some geeks graduated to corp dudes due to their free software involvement.
4)There is likely still some regular geeks hanging around, just hard to notice amidst all the suits.
I mean do you seriously think there is going to be bouncers at the door saying "Corporate people only".
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quote:
Remember an OS is not going to succeed if it is cool for geeks and programmers (unless it is a server). An OS succeeds if it is easy to use and works with everyone else COMPATIBILITY (sorry Macintosh)
If that is the criteria, I think the Mac fit's in very well.
Perhpse if certain overgrown monopolistic companies wouldn't be gobbling up the pie before anyone else has a slice there would be a bit more fair competition among software and hardware makers.
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the whole thing about Windows always being king is that they have TECH SUPPORT. if there is a problem at the office there will be a team of tech guys rushed over in an unmarked station wagon to fix the problem lol.
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yeah that's right, it's not as if you get better, faster and more helpful support from most large linux vendors for their products, than you get from microsoft for windows.
i will refrain from commenting on the concept of a company that charges by the minute for support.
avid, who gives a shit? you fail to add anything new, and while you seem quite intelligent, your apathy is exactly why people do not innovate, why they just make the world boring and commonplace.
true innovators, all the people who have moved us forward as a species, do not and did not ever, think in such an apathetic manner as you seem to think is the only correct way to be.
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quote:
Originally posted by Windows XP User #5225982375:
avid007, I'm one of the only people here who thinks Microsoft actually makes a good product (for home use, anyway) and even I don't believe that Microsoft is invulnerable, monopoly though it may be. Fact is, Steve Ballmer has publicly made it clear that Linux is the most worrisome problem Microsoft has ever faced. Since it isn't a company, more of a phenomenon, none of Microsoft's tactics seem to work on it. To think, people giving software away for free??!?? Steve can barely comprehend the notion itself, although he is beginning to pretend to cozy up to the idea, even going so far as to say he "loves open source." For him I imagine it's like cuddling up in bed with a pit viper. Before Linux came on the scene, the idea that people would actually give away software to combat Microsoft hadn't entered into even his darkest thoughts. After using some of the later versions of Linux myself, I have a feeling that Microsoft, and Apple for that matter, should be very wary of its progress. It only takes a couple of extra steps, and bam! No more proprietary operating systems. So, in my opinion, Microsoft is not invulnerable, even on the desktop. All they need to do is get complacent or make one wrong move (palladium, perhaps?) and it's over for them. I think it's great, since now we have something that will drive Microsoft to make even better products than it already does, and so even though it may stay around it will be stronger in the long run because of things like Linux.
WOW XP; I'm impressed- you're really starting to make sense, and you're actually saying GOOD thigs about Linux.
You're echoing what I think; as an OS, Windows whatever is what you make of it. For a new computer user, it's cake (no thinking involved) It does have stability problems, but I think a lot of that is the proprietary aspect that MS is forced to use. My biggest issue with Microsoft is their ruthless business practices; they seem to be willing to degrade their own product to make it difficult (or impossible) for anyone to create applications that can be used on a Windows system, and NOT be owned by Microsoft (or at least licenced by Microsoft). My box is free of MS; I removed WIN98 and I am going to replace it with an OS that doesn't have the "money before all else" philosophy that MS has. This doesn't mean that I'll have an OS that's more convenient than Windows; I don't think very many users would say that Linux is all that convenient, but I will be away from a philosophy of greed that seems to pervade anything Microsoft touches.
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I think this kid is just nervous because he spent all that money on his Microsoft crap and he doesn't want to be the last one left to use it. So he has to spread FUD. I guess he can't read. My kids have no trouble using Linux. My parents have no trouble using Linux. They are the most computer illiterate people on this earth and have no trouble.
I am using RedHat, downloaded for free (I don't know where this lining peoples pockets FUD come from). Then he insults my mother. Typical Microsoft user. Does Bill Gates have kids? Maybe this is one of his creations.
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quote:
Originally posted by avid007:
>>You come on here and say that we are wasting our time for a cause that doesn't exist. What is it that you think you are doing here?
I am simply getting on your nerves because you know I am right. Plus, I was bored tonight.
>>I don't know what Redhat did. I can still download Redhat for free from their site, what did they do?
You know exactly what they did. They sold the fuck out! Go to a Linux conference...ask anybody who has been here a while. It ain't techy cool anymore. It's all business now. All the causers just contributed to the wallets of someone else.
You know that is true. Let anybody tell me that Linux conferences aren't all business now.
I'm just saying know who you are working for.
-avid007
Linux conferences tend to be about business. For most of their larger ones this is their aim, corporates selling their products.
But....
This is linux, there is a flip side of the coin. There are still 'geeky' little meetings and there are plenty of little LUG's around. Yes there are large compnay's behind distributions, but yes there are many other less-well know distributions being used.
If you want something and don't want to look for it, you don't really want it. If you want any easy OS go get Mandrake/RedHat. If you want a difficult OS go and serach for one you like.
Hell, why not compile everything from the start?
But seriously, what the fuck do you want. Linux needs these businesses for success, and linux needs the geeks to be linux. Geeks don't like corporations and corporation dont like geeks. That is why linux's attack on the market is happening on two fronts.
Linux can be simple, linux can be hard, linux can be big, linux can be small. Just get what you want, that's the point what you want.
Also are you too young/stupid to understand that a large company or government agency doesnt want to use a product with no real backing behind it in their eyes?
Welcome to MES though dude, you're not that bad methinks. At least you're not XP luser (http://smile.gif)
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it is far too easy for people to conform to the m$ standard. as long as people have a desire to be in control of their own systems Linux will always have a home. if people like us didnt exist, M$ probably would have already won the war. No..our great war is no longer a spiritual one..it has become digital as well.
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quote:
I'm just saying know who you are working for.
I work for the Penguin, and the benefits are great!
Free software, and all the web-browsing I can handle. The hands-on training program is great, it's really challenging! :D
I used to work for microsoft, but I had to pay them, and if anything went wrong, they usually said it was my fault! And as far as training, goes, they just said, "...click the pretty little icon, and it'll do something, you don't need to know why and how, o.k.?"
:(
[ October 19, 2002: Message edited by: RudeCat7 ]
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Suddenly what avid said about Redhat is starting to get to me.
-39.95 for personal edition, cool.
-149.95 for professional edition, it starts to get a little pricey, still acceptable but with a raised eybrow.
-799.00 for advanced server, outrageous!
-1499.00 for advanced server V2.1 standard edition, ghastly!
-2499.00 for advanced server V2.1 premium edition, that is hellish!
Something is seriously wrong here. An open source, free software, once small company charging 2499.00 for software? Can anyone here explain why Redhat should not have stones thrown at them for such traitorous practices?
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Lazy, that price is for commercial support. You can get the software for free if you don't care about support.
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And you're missing the point of Free Software. RedHat charging high prices for support or even for distributing their software is great if it keeps them in business, and it belies the myth that F.S. won't pay the bills. Regardless of what RedHat charges for their software/support, you're still free to change/distribute it at will once you have it.
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Yes, but you can't download their special 799.00+ editions off their site... unless im wrong. Of course it may be possible to just grab an .iso from a third party site. I dunno, something about 799.00 for support seems like quite a rip-off. Unless that's more of a very long term support thing, and there would be a market for that in the corps(they will pay for ease of use, and tons of support is ease of use).
At least Redhat is selling support and not proprietary secrets. I mean the way free software works, I could download a pirated .iso of their $2400 server thingy, then burn it, then sell if for $50... 100% legally! Although some of the hardcore Linux purists would give me evil eyes. :D
I just wonder why they don't provide free downloads for EVERYTHING(just with no support) to save people the trouble of finding a pirated version. My guess is that they intentionally give you an excellent but not as rich version for free, and hope you'll just pay them to save the hassle(if you want the really powerful stuff). I mean the downloadable Redhat is probably not the same(in terms of extras) as the $139.00 professional edition.
Question is, are pirated versions of something like the $2400 Redhat alot easier to find then something like a pirated version of wind0ze? Of course this is not an issue for me, the shit they offer from the mainsite of a Linux distro will always be plenty for me.
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Firstly, I know nothing about RedHat's Advanced Server distributions, but if it's all GPL or similarly licenced software then, regardless of whether or not they make free downloads available, it's legal for anyone else to make isos available elsewhere. If you sold an iso of their OS, provided it is all GPL software, it would be perfectly legal and thus wouldn't be 'pirated', and there'd be absolutely nothing wrong with you selling it for $50.
Whether or not companies make their GPL'd free software available for easy download as isos, or they decide to charge a million dollars, it doesn't matter as the software is guaranteed by the GPL to be completely, unambiguously Free once it's been distributed.
I know it's been said a million times but you have to stop asking the question "How can it be 'free' when it costs $2500?" and think in terms of speech, not beer.
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Well im getting better at this free software concept, and even the free speech thing. I just had a little trouble understanding those hefty price tags. (http://smile.gif)
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Actually they do provide more than just support in the Avanced Server versions but that is the bulk of it. Wide scale enterprise support is the bulk of it. They also used to specially tune the kernel to run Oracle (Oracle is not Free Software, and if you think RedHat Advanced Server is expensive, check into Oracle licenses. RedHat prices look like a pimple on a giant's ass next to Oracle pricing).
They also provide RedHat cluster manager (something you certainly have no use for). But you can also cluster using RedHat using Free clustering utilities. I don't see what the complaint is. They are a company, they do have to pull in revenue. They are basically giving you the equivelant of Windows XP Server, SQL Server, Terminal Server, Exchange, Office, Visual Studio, etc, etc, etc. You want support directly from RedHat you pay for it.
I used a LOT of RedHat at the last large corporation I worked for. We used the download version of RedHat exclusively and did not purchase support (we had a tight budget so you can do a lot with free/Free). I have my own home brewed method of doing web server clustering and we didn't need to do any application clustering. Believe me, it would be rare that you as a user (and even as a small business) would need anything more than the download version. Large companies with big budgets may want/need the commercial support and proprietary database clustering capabilities.
[ October 20, 2002: Message edited by: void main ]
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I'll just pop my nose in. IE as the browser of choice ? This part of Windows I could do without. There are many reasons why people are making the switch from M$, for home use, this is one of them. I don't want my machine compromised with IE sending out statistics and Gawd knows what else back to the mothership. As an IT decision maker, the switch to Linux is very much on at the corporate level for cost effectiveness, security, stability and support. Also, (I know not everyone like IBM) IBM are embracing Linux with their Midrange server line such as the iSeries (AS400) which is the platform in use where I work.
At last, after 20 years in IT, something interesting is happening.
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quote:
Originally posted by avid007:
No solid AD structure.
-avid007
i dont know if this has already been said, because i've yet to take the time to read the two pages of posts, but:
did you know that AD is a ripoff of something called NDS?
i dont quite remember who created this, but i think it was novell.
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quote:
As an IT decision maker, the switch to Linux is very much on at the corporate level for cost effectiveness, security, stability and support. Also, (I know not everyone like IBM) IBM are embracing Linux with their Midrange server line such as the iSeries (AS400) which is the platform in use where I work.
You must be a moron. A smart IT decision? Where do you work? There is no way in hell any company would put up with their execs using Linux. It is just too damn complicated. Plus, there are compatibility issues that would seriously fuck up any big company. Now, if you work for a development company that makes software or something, that is a different story.
As for your AS/400 comments, you are wrong in saying the are "embracing" linux. The only thing that truly differentiates AS/400's is their reliable OS, OS/400 that is the key to their market and they would be foolish to give that up. Its reliability is the reason that banks, hospitals and other zero downtime institutions use them for their critical apps.
quote:
i dont know if this has already been said, because i've yet to take the time to read the two pages of posts, but:
did you know that AD is a ripoff of something called NDS?
i dont quite remember who created this, but i think it was novell.
I am well aware of that. Embrace and extend. However, it continues to work for MS. BASIC??? Windows (Xerox/Macintosh) IE(netscape)??? POWERPOINT (Harvard Graphics)??? JAVA(Sun)??
That is what makes MS smart and powerful. So, you can't authenticate Windows 2k or XP off of a Novell NDS and have all the operability that you have with AD, that is the point.
So, who cares who invented it, second place is often better than first if first place slept.
-avid007 :cool:
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quote:
you must be a moron
yes, you must.
Your first couple of posts were ok. hopelessly misguided and ill informed, but pretty bog standard and run of the mill. Now that people have responded to you and given you information, you turn out to be one of those idiots who refuses to believe anything except marketing bullshit. quote:
if first place slept
Funny how windows has taken 20 years to get where it is today, and by contrast, KDE has been on the go for 5 years, and GNOME for 4 years, and many people think they are superior desktop environments to windows. The majority who use windows have never used anything else, whereas everybody who has used linux or BSD has used windows at some point. Click here for more information on this subject (http://offiz.bei.t-online.de/open.html).
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A moron ? Really ? It must be spreading in the AS400 community then as my peers see it as a viable alternative and many of them are dabbling, myself included and I know a few who are going to make the switch and make it work come what may. Everyday I see articles on people making the switch from M$ to Linux. i have only seen one switch away from Linux, Hard Rock Hotels. Maybe Window$ will remain king, it's just that the Kingdom will be getting smaller.
Why wouldn't it work, what compatibility issues do you see ? What makes it so damn complicated ? Are our users such dimwitted fuckwits they can't learn anything new ?
You know something of the AS400 but you obviously don't work with it and you are certainly not aware of IBM's Linux strategy. There are IBM commercials running here that depict the
@(e)Server series and Linux running hand in hand.
IBM are well up for Linux and if you work with the AS400, you have to give that due consideration.
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avid is right in saying "it would be too complicated"
go to an office building and look how many stupid people there are. now, if we take those same stupid people and put them on Linux which is not as user friendly for things like printers and stuff like that, do you honestly think they would be able to do it? most people dont even know how to poke around through menus, my brother have no clue how to save pictures from the internet, i have to keep showing him over and over again.
if things that simple trip people up, there is no way they can cope with Linux.
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quote:
Originally posted by Chooco:
avid is right in saying "it would be too complicated"
go to an office building and look how many stupid people there are. now, if we take those same stupid people and put them on Linux which is not as user friendly for things like printers and stuff like that, do you honestly think they would be able to do it? most people dont even know how to poke around through menus, my brother have no clue how to save pictures from the internet, i have to keep showing him over and over again.
if things that simple trip people up, there is no way they can cope with Linux.
It's true, there are many stupid people who are required to use computers in the work place. So what's the difference between helping a fuckwit with a windows problem and a fuckwit with a Linux problem ? Either way, they need support. Besides, the problem is not the software, it's the users inability to grasp a concept. Are you adopted by any chance ?
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quote:
Originally posted by Chooco:
avid is right in saying "it would be too complicated"
go to an office building and look how many stupid people there are. now, if we take those same stupid people and put them on Linux which is not as user friendly for things like printers and stuff like that, do you honestly think they would be able to do it? most people dont even know how to poke around through menus, my brother have no clue how to save pictures from the internet, i have to keep showing him over and over again.
if things that simple trip people up, there is no way they can cope with Linux.
I have a feeling you have never worked in an "office environment". I have worked in an environment of around 3,000 users. Where WindowsNT Workstation was the exclusive desktop environment. I can tell you that we had the machines locked down so tight that the users could not change a thing, including adding printers on their workstation. This was all preconfigured by administrators. And if a change needed to be done, it was done by an administrator.
Many office environments are at least that strict. So in an office environment it's not a user issue, it's an administrator issue. And customizing the desktop/printing as an administrator is much easier on Linux than it is on Windows (assuming equally competent administrators for both platforms). The question is, can you find or develop the required applications for Linux to run your business. The answer right now is "yes" for some, and "no" for others.
[ October 21, 2002: Message edited by: void main ]
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Microsoft is already the king of the hill. The user base numbers, the widespread use of MS formats as a standard, the gaming+application and hardware support for MS Windows, The profit that MS makes even during an economic slump, etc. speaks for itself.
Longhorn and Blackcomb are going to be the final nails in the Open Source coffin.
[ October 21, 2002: Message edited by: Zombie9920 ]
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Zombie, when open source usage starts to decline rather than climb as it has been doing steadily and exponentially, then come back. Until then, everything you say is nothing more than FUD (Fear, Uncertainty, Doubt).
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Creedon wrote: My biggest issue with Microsoft is their ruthless business practices; they seem to be willing to degrade their own product to make it difficult (or impossible) for anyone to create applications that can be used on a Windows system, and NOT be owned by Microsoft (or at least licenced by Microsoft).
Creedon You get 5 stars because I totally agree with you.
Avid007: I rated you 5 stars too, because your points are well made and very rational. Also i agree with you, it is a good OS, even if their business practices are monopolistic.
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quote:
Originally posted by Happy XP User:
Creedon wrote: My biggest issue with Microsoft is their ruthless business practices; they seem to be willing to degrade their own product to make it difficult (or impossible) for anyone to create applications that can be used on a Windows system, and NOT be owned by Microsoft (or at least licenced by Microsoft).
Creedon You get 5 stars because I totally agree with you.
Avid007: I rated you 5 stars too, because your points are well made and very rational. Also i agree with you, it is a good OS, even if their business practices are monopolistic.
Microsofts' business practices aren't nearly as good as thier NT OSes..but hey, are there any honest businesses out there?
A business has to be ruthless to survive in the cut-throat corporate world. If a business isn't ruthless they will be plowed under by a bigger dog(like how MS plowed Apple and Be under).
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That's why Linux is better. It's not owned by a business. There is no "ruthlessness" involved. It's there for the people, by the people.
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quote:
Originally posted by void main:
That's why Linux is better. It's not owned by a business. There is no "ruthlessness" involved. It's there for the people, by the people.
The Linux kernel isn't owned by a business, but Linux distros are. Do you think for one minute that RedHat Software, Mandrake Software, Lindows, etc. wouldn't be ruthless if they had a chance to be ruthless?
Face it man, businesses want money and they need money to stay alive.
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quote:
Originally posted by Zombie9920:
The Linux kernel isn't owned by a business, but Linux distros are. Do you think for one minute that RedHat Software, Mandrake Software, Lindows, etc. wouldn't be ruthless if they had a chance to be ruthless?
Face it man, businesses want money and they need money to stay alive.
Distros are made up of the same free software that the kernel is. I have used RedHat for quite some time now, but honestly I could give a rats ass less if they go out of business tomorrow. I switch to Debian and keep on trucking (Debian is not owned by a business). I have no problem with people making a business "around" Linux which is what most of the distro vendors have done. But they do not own Linux.
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quote:
Originally posted by Zombie9920:
The Linux kernel isn't owned by a business, but Linux distros are. Do you think for one minute that RedHat Software, Mandrake Software, Lindows, etc. wouldn't be ruthless if they had a chance to be ruthless?
how will they get the chance? and you wonder why i call you a dumbass...
Hibeeboy, my girlfriend is adopted and she prefers to use linux, for your information. Also, just to clarify as i wasn't sure from your response, i was not agreeing with avid, i was, in fact, calling him a moron.
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quote:
Originally posted by Calum:
Hibeeboy, my girlfriend is adopted and she prefers to use linux, for your information. Also, just to clarify as i wasn't sure from your response, i was not agreeing with avid, i was, in fact, calling him a moron.
The flippant adoption remark was not intended to offend, it was my attempt at non PC humour. I mean, if the guys brother can't manage to attach/download something off the internet after being shown numerous times, are they really related ? Well, in Alabama you can be related.. --- never mind, it backfired the last time (http://redface.gif)
I took the liberty of assuming you were not calling me a moron.
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quote:
Originally posted by void main:
I have a feeling you have never worked in an "office environment". I have worked in an environment of around 3,000 users. Where WindowsNT Workstation was the exclusive desktop environment. I can tell you that we had the machines locked down so tight that the users could not change a thing, including adding printers on their workstation. This was all preconfigured by administrators. And if a change needed to be done, it was done by an administrator.
Many office environments are at least that strict. So in an office environment it's not a user issue, it's an administrator issue. And customizing the desktop/printing as an administrator is much easier on Linux than it is on Windows (assuming equally competent administrators for both platforms). The question is, can you find or develop the required applications for Linux to run your business. The answer right now is "yes" for some, and "no" for others.
[ October 21, 2002: Message edited by: void main ]
lol, at my mom's work, one of her co-workers opened an email attatchment and it shut down the entire network last week. i was suprised to find my mom come home at 1PM. the network was down so they just sent her and her friends home early :rolleyes:
i know what you mean though, at my school, the accounts are so tight SOOO TIGHT!!. there is no DOS prompt (thank god), i can't access the FTP port. i have absolutely no access to the local hard drive, only access to my segment of the network drive on the main server (which is like 30mb i think). i can't view certain forums such as the one at xtragaming.net and IE does not have Java, Flash or Shockwave. our school network has NEVER had a problem :D
[ October 21, 2002: Message edited by: Chooco ]