Stop Microsoft
Operating Systems => Linux and UNIX => Topic started by: istruthfull on 3 September 2003, 06:50
-
I have windows xp and the more I learn the more I don't like. What can I use to replace win xp that supports ntfs?
"Desired privacy doesn't mean having something to hide, just means chosing who you share with"
-
ntfs sux
-
Not very productive, but he's right. A good journaling system like ext3 or reiserfs is far better. Support for NTFS is pretty much non existent in BSD, Mac OS and a lot of others AFAIK while being very alpha in Linux. Sorry, but for now NTFS isn't something other OS's work well with.
-
Mandrake Linux web page (http://mandrake.com), has support for NTFS when it comes to editing partions, so I would guess it could mount and edit files in that partition as well.
I mention only incase our friend wants to dual boot
Mandrake also uses ReiserFS, this is a very fast, organized, and journaling file system. It's also the newest of the opensource file systems, and by the laws of evolution it's therefore the best.
-
I was just thinking,
could DRM make figuring out how to make Linux mount the new windows FS, in LongHorn, illegal?
-
Probably makes it illegal to even have Linux on the same PC as Windows... Oh and NTFS partition splitting is good, reading is good but writing is still alpha as far as I know. (could lead to corruption.)
-
quote:
Originally posted by Faust:
Not very productive, but he's right. A good journaling system like ext3 or reiserfs is far better. Support for NTFS is pretty much non existent in BSD, Mac OS and a lot of others AFAIK while being very alpha in Linux. Sorry, but for now NTFS isn't something other OS's work well with.
NTFS "is" a journaling filesystem. :rolleyes:
(EDIT)NTFS isn't a bad filesystem just because Linux doesn't support it that well. It has alot of good abilities. A little FAQ that lists all of NTFS's abilities.
http://www.anandtech.com/guides/viewfaq.html?i=63 (http://www.anandtech.com/guides/viewfaq.html?i=63)
[ September 02, 2003: Message edited by: Zombie9920 ]
-
Well, Microsoft never released the NTFS specs, so everything is reverse engineered. As such, the quality is not very good when it comes to the NTFS "drivers" (well, modules).
Mandrake allows you to resize NTFS partions _after_ you defrag them, thus not allowing Mandrake to accidently remove parts of files, etc.
NTFS read support is standard in many distros, though writing is usually not, because it often destroys the (NTFS) partition (on accident!).
Aside from that, I agree with Zombie. It's not _that_ bad--much better, than say, ext2 or FAT32.
-
I don't know how M$ can DRM this -- #mount -t ntfs /dev/hda1 /mount/point
-
quote:
NTFS "is" a journaling filesystem.
I said *good* and while it's better (much better) than fat32 it still fragments more than say ext3. I'm aware that it's journaling, we had that guy trying to tell us that the hidden meta data he found was a "secret spying cache" remember? (in the "microsofts hidden files" thread.
quote:
I don't know how M$ can DRM this -- #mount -t ntfs /dev/hda1 /mount/point
They can cover the filesystem with the DMCA, claim it as a business secret and then arrest you for trying to use it or indeed reverse engineer it. Kinda like how that dude got arrested for reverse engineering CSS. Also I'm willing to bet Linux drivers for Bills new filesystem would fall under "circumvention devices."
It'd be so nice if Windows could actually try and compete on a level field for once. Or even better if it was acknowledged that once you buy a piece of software / dvd player it's *yours* and you can reverse engineer it as much as you want.
-
quote:
Originally posted by istruthfull:
I have windows xp and the more I learn the more I don't like. What can I use to replace win xp that supports ntfs?
nothing. at present NTFS, unlike other journaling filesystems, is a private and secret filesystem. what this means is that if microsoft wanted to add ext3 and reiserfs support to windows, they could because the specification for those filesystems is open. If redhat and mandrake want to add NTFS support for linux, they can't at present because microsoft choose to keep the specification for that filesystem hidden, which causes a lot of work for everybody that could have been avoided simply because they want to make a quick buck.
At the end of the day, there are better OSs than XP with filesystems that are at least as good as NTFS. You might have to get used to the idea of an equivelant instead of something that's identical.
quote:
"Desired privacy doesn't mean having something to hide, just means chosing who you share with"
this is something i very much agree with, and i think it's a real shame that it even needs to be said. it's a sign of the times indeed.
[ September 03, 2003: Message edited by: Calum ]
-
quote:
Originally posted by Faust:
They can cover the filesystem with the DMCA, claim it as a business secret and then arrest you for trying to use it or indeed reverse engineer it.
if i ran a business and i heard about this i would not want my business' accounts, address books, records etc to be contained within a filesystem which was a trade secret of somebody else's company, and if i was one of the minority who reads the EULA before i agree, i would be even more wary that that company also witholds the right to read and alter that data at any time without my prior consent.
more info (http://belg88.com/faqman/index.php?op=view&t=75)
-
The Windows Media Player 9 EULA is supposed to be interesting too, I'll see if I can dig it up and post a link.
edit:
Not on msdn, not on windows.com, not on windowsmedia.com and not on microsoft.com but google has come up with this (http://fcasua.contad.unam.mx/video/player/FINAL_WMP_9s_Redist_SARA_1-4-2003a.pdf)
I can't download it though, maybe they're having technical difficulties... Can anyone else get it?
edit : fixed link
[ September 03, 2003: Message edited by: Faust ]
[ September 03, 2003: Message edited by: Faust ]
-
yes i did get it in the end, and it can now be found at http://www.openopen.cjb.net/files/ (http://www.openopen.cjb.net/files/) in the directory marked "licences" for those who want to read it.
edit: and you know why your link doesn't work? you've got a space before "FINAL" which makes the URL invalid ;)
another edit: i added the WMP9 EULA to the list in that link i linked to above too, just to make it nice and tidy.
[ September 03, 2003: Message edited by: Calum ]
-
Ah, that must be why I couldn't get to it from google either - I copied and pasted the URL so it's not a typo. Silly me, shoulda looked. :(
-
http://linux-ntfs.sourceforge.net/ (http://linux-ntfs.sourceforge.net/)
quote:
3.1 Which versions of NTFS can Linux read?
The Linux Driver can read all the versions of NTFS. Each version is slightly different, but the driver only has to interpret the files and directories. All the indexes that NTFS maintains can be safely ignored.
When the driver becomes able to write to an NTFS Volume, then it may be that the abilities will vary according to the version of NTFS it is writing to.
Back to the top
3.2 Can the Driver write to an NTFS volume, too?
Not really, but if you only need to copy files from Linux to Windows on a dual-boot machine, see "How to write to NTFS" below for a possible way to work around the lack of write support. For write support in Linux, read on.
There are two drivers, currently. The original driver, in 2.4 has some write code in it, but it is extremely dangerous to use it. The possibility of destroying your filesystem is very high.
The new driver, introduced in 2.5.11, has some write code, but it's very limited. The driver can overwrite existing files, but it cannot change the length, add new or delete existing files.
Adding write support will take a long time. NTFS is built like a database. Any changes you make, necessitate making changes in many places, for consistancy. Make a mistake and the filesystem will be damaged, make too many mistakes and the filesystem will be destroyed. Also, the current developers are only working on NTFS as a hobby, during their free time. If you'd like to help, please email me: [email protected].
-
EAT MORE BEEF !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
wow that felt good. My doctor says that I should not worry about microsoft so much. Even with medication just the knowledge of how many millions of people buy wintel machines each year gives me a hard time sleeping at night. Its difficult really. My only hope is to surround myself with penguins and Apples. YES THATS IT !!
PENGUINS AND APPLES !
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH !!!!!!!!!!!