Stop Microsoft
Operating Systems => macOS => Topic started by: excyle-the-art-fag on 13 July 2003, 15:13
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You know, this is not a trollpost, so if you delete it you are a nazi moderator offically.
I have not really used OS X much, but what useful features (not useless UI features that simily waste my time) does it have that say GNOME on Red-Hat 8.0 dont need.
NONE
Im not including software compatability, and I dont use Photoshop, Macromedia.
This is what I need in my machine...
A) GAMES WHERE YOU KILL PEOPLE (WineX + GTA3 Vice City)
B) OpenOffice.org
C) Mozilla
D) Ximian Evolution
E) mplayer
F) PORN
G) RUN ON A SHITBOX INTEL BECAUSE IM POOR
Mac OS X cant do this because it is evil. Apple are trying to make a 2 class system of Apple and Non Apple users.
They also did a whorejob of the Mach Kernel, which is bad.
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quote:
Originally posted by Look at me dance:
You know, this is not a trollpost, so if you delete it you are a nazi moderator offically.
I have not really used OS X much, but what useful features (not useless UI features that simily waste my time) does it have that say GNOME on Red-Hat 8.0 dont need.
NONE
Im not including software compatability, and I dont use Photoshop, Macromedia.
This is what I need in my machine...
A) GAMES WHERE YOU KILL PEOPLE (WineX + GTA3 Vice City)
B) OpenOffice.org
C) Mozilla
D) Ximian Evolution
E) mplayer
F) PORN
G) RUN ON A SHITBOX INTEL BECAUSE IM POOR
Mac OS X cant do this because it is evil. Apple are trying to make a 2 class system of Apple and Non Apple users.
They also did a whorejob of the Mach Kernel, which is bad.
well. osx is a very stable system running on very stable hardware. i bought it that way. i did not have to do anything to get it there. it is perfect out of the box. see, that is the thing about apple. it is not for everyday computer users, i feel they are made strictly for certain people with certain needs, ie, design professionals. period. they try to venture out into other areas, but i see these systems as being custom built for design pros. i never have to open a terminal, i never have to compile anything. i also never have blue screens, or have an app bring the system down. osx, or rather aqua, is exactly what *nix needs. too bad quartz & aqua were not GPL'd.
I am running Open Office & MS Office, 4 different browsers, mplayer. word. games? i am sure i could get some games for the mac, but i would rather use it for other things. someone else would have to answer that. i have had redhat restart for no fucking reason on me several times. osx has not done that. redhat does not crash nearly as much as say, windows, but the fact that i crash the system says alot. the only time(s) i have crashed osx was when i didnt unmount samba shares and turned the other computer off. then osx freajed out because the other computer was off, but had a volume mounted. that is it. not too bad. for the money, i feel the mac is more than worth it.
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quote:
Originally posted by ecsyle:951:
well. osx is a very stable system running on very stable hardware. i bought it that way. i did not have to do anything to get it there. it is perfect out of the box. see, that is the thing about apple. it is not for everyday computer users, i feel they are made strictly for certain people with certain needs, ie, design professionals. period. they try to venture out into other areas, but i see these systems as being custom built for design pros. i never have to open a terminal, i never have to compile anything. i also never have blue screens, or have an app bring the system down. osx, or rather aqua, is exactly what *nix needs. too bad quartz & aqua were not GPL'd.
I am running Open Office & MS Office, 4 different browsers, mplayer. word. games? i am sure i could get some games for the mac, but i would rather use it for other things. someone else would have to answer that. i have had redhat restart for no fucking reason on me several times. osx has not done that. redhat does not crash nearly as much as say, windows, but the fact that i crash the system says alot. the only time(s) i have crashed osx was when i didnt unmount samba shares and turned the other computer off. then osx freajed out because the other computer was off, but had a volume mounted. that is it. not too bad. for the money, i feel the mac is more than worth it.
You're right ecsyle:951 but I don't think that OS X is solely a design platform now, you're implying it's only for photoshopers and the like. OS X is the platform of choice for a lot of developers, including myself. I use terminal about 70% of the time and I don't even have Photoshop on my machine.
I also run OpenOffice X11, mplayer you're not going to need cos Quicktime & iTunes etc... beats the hell out of any else our there.
I must say, call me bias if you want but OS X is one of the very best OS's out there at the moment and yes I've tried plenty others infact I use Suse regularly.
If you're worried about cost, buy a refurb.
(http://tongue.gif)
[ July 13, 2003: Message edited by: Zardoz ]
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quote:
Originally posted by Zardoz:
You're right ecsyle:951 but I don't think that OS X is solely a design platform now, you're implying it only for photoshopers and the like. OS X is the platform of choice for a lot of developers, including myself. I use terminal about 70% of the time and I don't even have Photoshop on my machine.
I also run OpenOffice X11, mplayer you're not going to need cos Quicktime & iTunes etc... beats the hell out of any else our there.
I must say, call me bias if you want but OS X is one of the very best OS's out there at the moment and yes I've tried plenty others infact I use Suse regularly.
yeah, i didnt want it to sound like it is sctrictly for photoshoppers, but it is a specialized machine in a way. it is not for the average consumer. it is a tool, not a toy, it is a serious peice of equipment. when i go to comp usa and pick up some random computer peices, i go home and build a toy to play with. but my mac is the only tool i have that is built for it. my pcs are random peices thrown together on which i run a few os's. not to talk shit about x86 and clone pcs, but the mac feels solid. it feels like a bmw. ehh. i will try to clarify later. i am tired and need sleep. its like 6:30am.
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if you want games where you kill people on a mac heres a few off the top of my head(many are fairly old):
1. Red Faction
2. Unreal Tournament 2003
3. Medal of Honor
4. quake 3
5. deus ex
6. all the blizzard games
7. Postal
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quote:
Originally posted by ecsyle:951:
yeah, i didnt want it to sound like it is sctrictly for photoshoppers, but it is a specialized machine in a way. it is not for the average consumer. it is a tool, not a toy, it is a serious peice of equipment. when i go to comp usa and pick up some random computer peices, i go home and build a toy to play with. but my mac is the only tool i have that is built for it. my pcs are random peices thrown together on which i run a few os's. not to talk shit about x86 and clone pcs, but the mac feels solid. it feels like a bmw. ehh. i will try to clarify later. i am tired and need sleep. its like 6:30am.
No that's cool man, I get you.
You sound about as crazy as I am, I've been going to bed at 4:30'ish recently. Get some sleep.
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OS-X Users are like fucking Volvo drivers.
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No, they are like many other NeXT, BeOS, Amiga and Acorn fans who actually love their platform for their merits, rather than because it is industry standard (ie. Microsofties) or for political reasons (like free software or open source) or, in some cases, because they don't want to pay for what they use.
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In reply to the Mac feels like a BMW comment.
PC's are like Cheverolet, Dodge and Ford. You can get one that will smoke the BMW for less money.
A $50,000 Corvette Z06, a $63,000 Dodge Viper GTS-R or a $40,000 Mustang SVT Cobra will beat the hell out of any beemer on the track, on the strip or even in a street race. A top of the line beemer costs alot more than a Dodge Viper GTS-R. However, the cheaper Corvette Z06 and Viper GTS-R will beat the hell out of that Cobra which already beats out the ridiculously expensive beemer.
You know that the $70,000 BMW M5(thats right...$70,000 for a fucking family sedan) tops out at like 150mph? What kind of shit is that? I mean come'on....the $50,000 Corvette Z06 tops out at 183mph stock and the $63,000 Viper GTS-R tops out at about 201mph stock.
I guess you are right. Mac's are the BMW of computers. You pay more for less performance and the people who pay for the ridiculously overpriced, underpowered machines are led to believe that thier machine is magically special or something.
[ July 14, 2003: Message edited by: Zombie9920 ]
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quote:
You pay more for less performance and the people who pay for the ridiculously overpriced, underpowered machines are led to believe that thier machine is magically special or something.
I have very little knowledge about cars, so I will have to give you the benefit of doubt on that. But asserting that you pay more for less performance when you buy a Mac certainly betrays your ignorance on the matter. Surely you must have heard of the G5 by now? Even before its release, there are reports of tests with G5s handling scientific jobs very adequately, at a much lesser price. And the NASA seems to agree with that, too. So your argument is a bit dated now.
As for personal users, it has often been demonstrated that Macs and many other alternative platforms are much less expensive and more productive in the long run than Wintel computers. And even the initial prices, with every feature taken into account, are very competitive.
Of course, if price is your major concern, it is still possible to build your own Mac. There are many tutorials online for that purpose.
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quote:
Originally posted by Zombie9920:
In reply to the Mac feels like a BMW comment.
PC's are like Cheverolet, Dodge and Ford. You can get one that will smoke the BMW for less money.
A $50,000 Corvette Z06, a $63,000 Dodge Viper GTS-V(or even the $55,000 GTS-R for that matter) or a $70,000 Mustang GT Cobra R will beat the hell out of any beemer on the track, on the strip or even in a street race. A top of the line beemer costs alot more than the Mustang Cobra(the most expensive of the x86 comparison). However, the cheaper Corvette Z06 and the mid-priced Viper GTS-V will beat the hell out of that more expensive Cobra R which already beats out the ridiculously expensive beemer.
You know that the $65,000 BMW M5(thats right...$65,000 for a fucking family sedan) tops out at like 140mph? What kind of shit is that? I mean come'on....the $50,000 Corvette Z06 tops out at 183mph stock and the $63,000 Viper GTS-V tops out at about 192mph stock.
I guess you are right. Mac's are the BMW of computers. You pay more for less performance and the people who pay for the ridiculously overpriced, underpowered machines are led to believe that thier machine is magically special or something.
[ July 13, 2003: Message edited by: Zombie9920 ]
the m5 tops at 173mph.
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okay, everybody does the mac = bmw thing wrong.
for one, comparing a bmw to a dodge/honda/etc isn't correct. they are in a different market. dodge sells to the average consumer, as an average car maker. bmw sells to people who want a sports/luxury car with many features they will probably never use and amazing build quality. i mean.. look at the crash test ratings of some of the german cars compared to everything else, is your life worth an extra $20k? (http://smile.gif)
anyways.. comparing a mac and pc is pretty much the same way. you just can't do it. the only thing that even compared to a mac was the bebox.
once again, i am a genius.
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Now I think of it, Zombie, there are a few important thing I have been taught about cars: people seldom go any faster than 100 km/h on highways without being arrested (I use the metric system, so I don't know how much 183 mph is). Therefore, basing your arguments that one brand is overpriced on the power of its motor is a bit flawed. Perhaps you should consider the merits of a comfortable, luxurious car, or a durable car that will last longer without repairs, or perhaps a car that will cost you much less in the long run with a low fuel consumption.
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There are a couple of things I'd like to say in reply to X11's post.
When talking about OS X we have to either talk about OS X's licensing issues or about the software itself. I choose not to talk about the former simply because OS X is not Free or Open Source Software in any way but rather talk about the latter which is simply OS X's architecture.
OS X is based on Darwin as you may or may know, which is simply a FreeBSD derivative. OS X's subsystem is therefore remarkably stable. As for the Mach microkernel, well do you happen to know many systems that run on a microkernel instead of a monolithic one, like GNU/Linux does? As for the differences, I urge you to google it up before referring to the Mach microkernel as garbage.
OS X's other layers, like Quartz and Aqua as well as the Cocoa and the Carbon frameworks that have been added by Apple's engineers, that's another story. Yes, OS X has all the eye-candy anyone would want or yet again if you don't want it you can simply use the console. The truth however is that many programmers love to program in OS X.
As for myself, I think that I'll soon be running GentooPPC on my iBook solely. This doesn't mean of course that I don't like OS X. OS X simply smokes and those who tell you otherwise are all of the times people that haven't used it. I chose to install Linux only because I'm worried about Apple's licensing policy but those of you who aren't keep using OS X, which is by far the most technically advanced OS out there today.
Just my 2 (Euro)cents ;)
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WTF!!! what's all this comparing OS's to car's?
X11 explain to me why OS X users are like volvo drivers? What there reliable, it's reliable? What?
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ehh. i use bmw because they are refined and clean. yeah, i could go buy some cheap car, dump like 10 grand into it and i have some fast little POS. maybe i should compare it to audi, lexus, and bmw. american cars are crap. but im not a car guy, so i am not going to try and debate that. its an opinion.
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Hehehehe. Analogies, OK that's fine, I get ya, but then X11 goes and says Mac users are live Volvo drivers??? Don't know if that's an insult or compliment :confused:
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Well... since you can't decide on what to campare QSX to, I'm pretty sure I found MS Bob (http://fett101.mine.nu/space/car.jpg)
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X11 Speaks teh truth.
Sort of
OS X isn't necessarily bad but Mac hardware = trash.
My brother got an emac, and it was so slow it couldn't even run warcraft 3 so he returned it, and had to pay Apple a 200 dollar restocking fee. Bastards.
Sure the G5 is fast and all but what if you want a laptop? Let's compare...
I could get a Toshiba P25 which has a 2.8 ghz P4, Geforce FX 5200, and a 17'' screen for 2000 dollars, or I could get a 1 ghz Powerlessbook G4 which also has a 17'' screen but costs $3200. Hmmm.
I think I'd rather get the Toshiba and put Slackware Linux on it.
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1. If you buy a Toshiba, you would be giving your money to Microsoft to pay for Windows XP.
2. It is a known fact that Warcraft 3 is slow on Mac OS X, and Warcraft 3 would have performed very well on OS 9, from what I've heard. Many game developpers have not switched from Carbon yet.
3. A Pentium 4 processor, unlike a G4, cannot run full speed on a laptop for more than half an hour before you have to change the battery. And you should know very well that a 1 GHz G4 is more or less the equivalent of a 2.0 GHz Pentium 4 (I don't know the equivalence for Athlons).
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To each his own
If your happy with what you've got, Im happy for you.
But(you knew that was coming)
I hear people saying that most people only use Linux because it's free
It cost me $170.00 CND after taxes (3000%) to get SuSE 8.1 professional
a group of my friends and myself all use SuSE
one of us bought 8.0, I bought 8.1, and another bought 8.2 and so on until SCO wins :D ;) :D
but really apple, and x86 are like beta, and VHS
VHS ended up winning because of price, but beta was a hell of alot better quality, and for that reason VHS was household, and beta was, and is, an industry standard.
And as for being political, those of us who sign up and actually stay here, only do so beacuse we are political. You should all be as political as possible inside your own country, I really mean that. Democracy is a funny thing, if you don't use it you'll lose!
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quote:
Originally posted by sway = eradicator:
the m5 tops at 173mph.
You are on crack. A M5 doesn't go anywhere near that speed. Admittedly I was wrong about the M5 though. The new ones top out at 155mph. They still don't have nothing on a cheaper Corvette Z06(or the standard Vette Coupe for that matter), Dodge Viper GTS-V and GTS-R or the Mustang GT Cobra and SVT Cobra R.
http://www.new-cars.com/2003/bmw/bmw-m5-specs.html (http://www.new-cars.com/2003/bmw/bmw-m5-specs.html)
To the guy who said American cars are crap, you are an idiot. I haven't had a lick of trouble out of my Vette and it is about 5 years old now(99). I'm willing to bet that it will smoke anything that you own and it isn't anywhere near as fast as these new Vettes with the LS6 engine. ;P
[ July 14, 2003: Message edited by: Zombie9920 ]
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A 2003 Corvette Z06. Top speed of 185mph. Wow! That is fast for a $50,000 range car. IT appears that the Vette gets better gas mileage than a beemer too.
http://www.fast-autos.net/guldstrand/guldstrand50thcorvette.html (http://www.fast-autos.net/guldstrand/guldstrand50thcorvette.html)
A Vette that costs around $50,000 is actually able to contend with and beat out alot of the Ferrari's. LoL, the beemer is simply outclassed and out-muscled. I really don't think that beemers look all that great myself. I would be more proud of owning a Viper than a damn beemer.
[ July 14, 2003: Message edited by: Zombie9920 ]
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Last but not least..here are some specs on the Viper GTS-R. DAAAAAMMMNNN! A 0-60 in 3.8 seconds! A top speed of 201mph!
Not many cars on the road can contend with this beast. The ones that can contend with it cost about a half million to a million $$$$(Like the McLaren F1 which is a German car BTW).
http://www.ultimatecarpage.com/frame.mv?file=car.mv&num=117 (http://www.ultimatecarpage.com/frame.mv?file=car.mv&num=117)
Beemers are overpriced cars, under-powered cars...end of story. I've seen Honda Accord EX's that that can smoke a beemer. :rolleyes:
[ July 14, 2003: Message edited by: Zombie9920 ]
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We are being political because we unite against Microsoft. But choice of platform should be determined by its qualities, not by political issues like open source. One should not choose to boycott a platform because of frivolous political reasons like closed source.
And comparing the Mac to the Beta is absolutely ridiculous. This is a MONOPOLY situation, remember? The Mac wasn't expensive back in the days, and studies have proven over and over again that the Mac is much cheaper in the long run. Also, Macs are getting cheaper by the season.
Sorry if I don't make any sense, but I'm tired. I'll edit all that tomorrow.
Going to bed, it'a 3 AM.
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quote:
Originally posted by Zombie9920:
Last but not least..here are some specs on the Viper GTS-R. DAAAAAMMMNNN! A 0-60 in 3.8 seconds! A top speed of 201mph!
Not many cars on the road can contend with this beast. The ones that can contend with it cost about a half million to a million $$$$(Like the McLaren F1 which is a German car BTW).
http://www.ultimatecarpage.com/frame.mv?file=car.mv&num=117 (http://www.ultimatecarpage.com/frame.mv?file=car.mv&num=117)
Beemers are overpriced cars, under-powered cars...end of story. I've seen Honda Accord EX's that that can smoke a beemer. :rolleyes:
[ July 14, 2003: Message edited by: Zombie9920 ]
Eeeerrrmmm, the engine is BMW but the car is British, there made not far from were I used to live. McLaren is a Brit company
The most incredible car I've seen is the new Zonda, we have a car show here in the UK and they put every car you could imagine up against each other Vipers, Ferrari, Zonda everything. They were all run Straight line and then on a specially designed course. The Zonda left all of them in the dust, I've never seen a car grip the road like this. The power to weight ration is frightening.
Zonda (http://www.paganiautomobili.it/)
Here's the video of the road test for the Zonda
Zonda test (http://www.racingflix.com/browsevideos.asp?p=6)
You have to register, worth it though.
Actually in the test though the Zonda didn't win, it was a Westfield XTR2, there is also a video of that on the same page.
[ July 14, 2003: Message edited by: Zardoz ]
[ July 14, 2003: Message edited by: Zardoz ]
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quote:
You must turn yourself onto politics, or else politics will turn on you.
--Ralph Nader
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quote:
Originally posted by Zardoz:
Eeeerrrmmm, the engine is BMW but the car is British, there made not far from were I used to live. McLaren is a Brit company
The most incredible car I've seen is the new Zonda, we have a car show here in the UK and they put every car you could imagine up against each other Vipers, Ferrari, Zonda everything. They were all run Straight line and then on a specially designed course. The Zonda left all of them in the dust, I've never seen a car grip the road like this. The power to weight ration is frightening.
Zonda (http://www.paganiautomobili.it/)
Here's the video of the road test for the Zonda
Zonda test (http://www.racingflix.com/browsevideos.asp?p=6)
You have to register, worth it though.
Actually in the test though the Zonda didn't win, it was a Westfield XTR2, there is also a video of that on the same page.
[ July 14, 2003: Message edited by: Zardoz ]
[ July 14, 2003: Message edited by: Zardoz ]
That Zonda reminds me of a Mercedes CLK-GTR.
A really nice, fast car...with a price tag of about 1 million $$$.
http://www.users.globalnet.co.uk/~anchsa/clkgtr.htm (http://www.users.globalnet.co.uk/~anchsa/clkgtr.htm)
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didnt' that win the Le Mans 24hr, 3 times, on a row???
Anyway yes great looking Car, much like OS X, great looking, excellent performing.
just trying to keep in the vein of things, we've gone from OS X to Cars :D
Another Great car Ford GT40 and now the new one:
GT40 2003 (http://www.fordvehicles.com/fordgt/home.asp?bhcp=1).......... any day over a Viper, more refined looking
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quote:
Originally posted by Zombie9920:
A 2003 Corvette Z06. Top speed of 185mph. Wow! That is fast for a $50,000 range car. IT appears that the Vette gets better gas mileage than a beemer too.
http://www.fast-autos.net/guldstrand/guldstrand50thcorvette.html (http://www.fast-autos.net/guldstrand/guldstrand50thcorvette.html)
A Vette that costs around $50,000 is actually able to contend with and beat out alot of the Ferrari's. LoL, the beemer is simply outclassed and out-muscled. I really don't think that beemers look all that great myself. I would be more proud of owning a Viper than a damn beemer.
[ July 14, 2003: Message edited by: Zombie9920 ]
well, sure.. the corvette is a good value for performance. but a jetta is built better, and much more affordable. just look at safety ratings.
anyways, you're just warped on the whole muscle car idea. you sort of remind me of the people that have these 2000watt stereo systems in their car. only morons choose quantity over quality.
and once again, i am a pure genius. and yes, the bmw m5 can hit 170-ish mph, i've seen it happen. all you need is a good driver, and a track to drive on.
[ July 14, 2003: Message edited by: sway = eradicator ]
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quote:
Originally posted by Linux User #5225982375:
X11 Speaks teh truth.
Sort of
OS X isn't necessarily bad but Mac hardware = trash.
My brother got an emac, and it was so slow it couldn't even run warcraft 3 so he returned it, and had to pay Apple a 200 dollar restocking fee. Bastards.
Sure the G5 is fast and all but what if you want a laptop? Let's compare...
I could get a Toshiba P25 which has a 2.8 ghz P4, Geforce FX 5200, and a 17'' screen for 2000 dollars, or I could get a 1 ghz Powerlessbook G4 which also has a 17'' screen but costs $3200. Hmmm.
I think I'd rather get the Toshiba and put Slackware Linux on it.
i'd like to say: thank you for not being a zealot.
or in ebay terms: "GREAT TRANSACTION! ASSET TO THE LINUX COMMUNITY A+++!"
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Some intelligent and well informed people like Macs, some intelligent and well informed people like Linux or BSD or Unix, can we leave it at that? Personally I love Linux and now that I know what the hell I'm doing with it I prefer it far more to Mac OS X but that doen't mean everybody will, so quit your bitching about "technical merits" everybody. And for fucks sake what the hell is with cars? What in gods name do cars have to do with PC's? Although if anyone wants to start a Windows/Intel/AMD box = a Lada Niva analogy I would be most grateful. ;)