Stop Microsoft
Miscellaneous => The Lounge => Topic started by: hm_murdock on 9 October 2002, 16:20
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Not sure if this is the correct forum... but since it's not a discussion of hardware or OS, I figured this was the place.
Now, down to bidness. How many fellow Macheads have ever been personally insulted because of your choice of platforms? I mean, when someone goes beyond trashing Apple or our beloved Macs, and actually tears you down personally for being a Mac user.
And, on a similar vein. How many Linux guys have been insulted for not being a drone?
And the ultimate question... why can't people leave us alone to make our own choices?
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usually when people insult me for not using microsoft's stuff it is because i have droned on for ages about it to start with so it's really all my own fault! :D
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I can't say that I've ever been insulted by anyone because I chose to use non-Windows OSes. On the contrary when I was using Linux on my previous laptops everyone was really amazed by what I've told them and I'm actually very proud for having converted a few friends of mine to using Linux. Well they actually dual boot but let's not be ungrateful (http://smile.gif) .
Wait. I remember once a teacher of mine in an introductory class in Computers telling me that if I was an IT and insisted on using Linux, I would stay unemployed :eek: . Talk about ignorance :D
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Ive never been laughed at because I use linux, in fact people assume that I must be extremely intelligent since I know how to work the command line.....lol
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As a Mac user I have gotten shit from PC heads. I remember having this inane argument with my Aunt trying to explain to her why multi-media support on a Mac was supperior.
All she kept rattling off was "I've got MMX" like she had an Intel Inside sticker stuck to her forhead.
Many times I have gotten lip from l33t gamer d00dz who think the meaning of life is fragging people in half-life. Dood! Maks have no gamzzzz!!!!
Funny thing was, they started a LAN party and ended up using an OSX G4 as a server cuz they coulden't get the NT machine to work LOLOLOLOLOLOL!!!
[ October 09, 2002: Message edited by: psyjax ]
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I've had Windows users attack me that way.
I've also had Linux users do this, despite the fact that I was much more proficient at wielding the Mac OS than they were at understanding Linux.
Hmmm........
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I find that most people who rag on Linux and Mac are the same people who need help dragging the taskbar back to the bottom of the screen.
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I just have one problem with macs. Mac has a history of a shitty operatating system right? Just because there modern operating system works great now, why should they be forgiven?
Alright I woulden't know from first hand experience, well I have used macs before. Never had a problem with them, in fact I was weened on the apple IIe playing those ghey educational games from MECC. Then came the ub3r l33t(compared to those IIe's) macintoshes.
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When I first tried using linux, I was one of those assholes who was just using it because they wanted to be "1337". I wanted to be a hax0r and after a week I got bored with it and quit. Several years later after I graduated from college with a major in Computer Information Systems, I got kind of big into web design and at this point I became frustrated with hosting services and decided that I needed my own webserver. To be truthful I looked into Microsoft first, but quickly realized that my budget was nowhere near big enough to run a MS server. I also heard that they were very insecure. So I looked into linux again and installed a dual boot system to get started. Even though I had been dabbling in the OS a little bit before, I found I knew next to nothing about it. So I took a Linux/Apache webserver class at the local community college. I learned a lot, and I eliminated the windows partition to begin using linux full time. While taking the class I also took a MCP class(Windows 2000 Server Security) and in that class I met a lot of criticism about my preference for linux. The one thing I learned about Windows 2000 as compared to linux is that once you get deep into Active Directory and security, it is just as complicated if not more so than linux. I was told constantly that linux was too difficult to admin to be practical, yet in my opinion it is no more difficult than Windows. Dont let the fact that you modify text files in linux lead you to believe that it is difficult or obsolete. I had a classmate who thought the linux gui looked worse than windows 3.1, but I soon realized he had seen the old kde and thought it pretty weak. After showing him kde 2.2.x, he admitted it looked pretty good. The one issue I get battered with most is hardware support.Windows users love plug and play, and I like it too, unfortunately since very little hardware is made to work with linux, this might always be a problem. After defending linux on every issue, they declare that Im just being stupid since I wont admit that windows was superior. All I can say is that if you believe people who want to use something different are stupid, I must be head moron.
A good comparison would be the manual transmission(linux), versus the automatic transmission(windows). The manual transmission is more difficult to drive, it takes longer to learn, and requires more work to be good at driving it, but it gets better gas mileage, accelerates faster, and breaks down far less than the automatic transmission.
[ October 09, 2002: Message edited by: ThePreacher ]
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quote:
Originally posted by lazygamer:
I just have one problem with macs. Mac has a history of a shitty operatating system right? Just because there modern operating system works great now, why should they be forgiven?
Huh?
I disagree whole-heartedly! Their OS kicks the shit out of windows anyday!
Classic (OS9 or earlyer) was faster, snappier, and a shit load more stable and user friendly than Windoze.
Granted, many folks complaine about Mac's crashing too much, and I'd be lieing if I sayd crashing on Mac's was not a pain in the Ass, but in my years using Classic I have managed to keep my computer running as stable (if not more) as a WinTel box.
Any el337 Mac user worth his salt can trim down an Extension parade, and configure INITs and Memory alocations. And if you are good at it, you can run a very stable system. Especialy back in the glory days of OS 7 :D (Hey, it's easyer than digging in the Registry (http://tongue.gif) )
In this Modern age of OS's OSX is the ONLY OS that truely dosn't crash. IMHO Apple is the God of OS's hands down, why do you think M$ is allways copying them?
[ October 09, 2002: Message edited by: psyjax ]
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Speaking of Mac OS7, I got all nostalgic and crap and thought Id drop this link:
http://toastytech.com/guis/mac755.html (http://toastytech.com/guis/mac755.html)
It's hard to belive that Windoze today isn't nearly as well designed as OS7 was then!
And check out this:
http://toastytech.com/guis/macos81.html (http://toastytech.com/guis/macos81.html)
Granted, I still think 7.5 was the Classic OS high-point, but OS8 has some ultra-excellent fetures. Please tell me M$ has a better designed OS? jeezz. go home.
Sorry... That sort of talk raises the hair on the back of my neck and I go into rant mode :D
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Amen, psyjax!
the classic OS had years of development behind it. I've seen Macs running any version of it from 7.0 on be rock solid, running for weeks with no problems.
However, as a comp. lab asst. I also see the OS get assraped by everybody d/ling every IM, filesharing, and email client on the farking planet and clogging up the Extensions folder. At the end of every day, I just set all of their Extension Managers back to a configuration based on 9.2 on my own iMac.
Certainly nothing flaky about it! Now badly written apps... that's another topic...
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Ah, just last night I told a friend I was planning on putting Linux on my computer. He riddiculed me saying Windows was much more secure.
This is where the Riddler's Really Hidden files came into it. I took him to his computer and showed him his history that he "deleted" often was very much still there. I then reminded him Linux, unlike Windows does what it is told.
His dad then walked in "Linux is old!" he said strongly, "WinXP Pro is the best." My friend and I both showed him the secretly hidden History contents and then he was upset. I then explained to both of them I was unsure about using MacOS or Linux, they both laughed at MacOS, I tapped the screen of their monitors and they shut up.
My mate is building his own computer same as me (he'll do it quickly because he has money, I don't :( ) and he's put me incharge of finding a suitable OS. I told him Dual Boot for a while, as that's what I'm doing (to get a feel for it, if he doesn't like it he can use Windows until a new one is installed, software etc. etc. etc.) until he is confident enough with it to wipe Windows.
Our only problem, which distro of Linux to choose? And how to get them?
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If you have high speed connection see my tag line. If not you can order the CDs directly from the distro vendor or from Linux CD sites for very little. If you download them you can try a few and see which you like most. RedHat, SuSe, Mandrake are all pretty good for the beginner and the experienced.
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quote:
Originally posted by Kat:
I find that most people who rag on Linux and Mac are the same people who need help dragging the taskbar back to the bottom of the screen.
! forty points! (yes i saw that on the windows BS as well!)...
edit - psyjax, i just noticed that those macos7 and 8 screenshots are from an ix86 computer running a motorola emulator!
[ October 10, 2002: Message edited by: Calum ]
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quote:
Originally posted by Calum:
edit - psyjax, i just noticed that those macos7 and 8 screenshots are from an ix86 computer running a motorola emulator!
Yea, there is an old Mac emulator called Basilisk. I think it can run MacOS up to 8.5, but it's not very fast from my understanding. Still it's pretty neat.
The guy who runs the site is on a PC, but he dosn't seem to like Windoze or IE very much :D
He also has a huge gallery of other GUI's, including an x86 version of Rhapsody!! Proving that Apple is indeed keeping a development x86 version of OSX in their back rooms. When they will spring it on the world? Time will tell.
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Oh dude, i been there and i know what you mean. Basicaly the people who do that are plain old 24/7 porn surfers computer users or 15 year old pricks that dont know any better.
If someone insults me about trivial things like OS then he realy needs a life and I just smile with sarcasm. Silence speaks louder than words many times.
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What about insulting a wind0ze user over his choice of OS? :D
24/7 porn surfers? The problem with porn surfing is that you want more worse and worse content and eventually you start to become mildly insane. ;)
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psyjax, Basilisk runs up to 8.1. 8.5 and up require a Power Macintosh.
Basilisk is a good emu, though. it supports full color, runs terribly fast, and is very compatible with Mac 68K software.
If you wanna fiddle around with a moderately modern Mac OS when on a PC, check it out.
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quote:
Originally posted by lazygamer:
What about insulting a wind0ze user over his choice of OS? :D
24/7 porn surfers? The problem with porn surfing is that you want more worse and worse content and eventually you start to become mildly insane. ;)
well ok. Those are always fun to give them hell.
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i bash macs all the time because they never seem to work properly at school. my school has lots of wintels and maybe 30 macs or so... the macs are fast with excellent graphics BUT half the students' login IDs and passwords don't even work, it has HUGE problems trying to pass through the school's proxy and it always gets errors when starting up where it has the picture of a bomb and the only button you can select is 'restart'
the wintel computers at school don't have those problems, all names and passwords work, they never actually crash (no intensive work like servers or games) and they actually have 2 buttons where you can just right click and select the function you want. despite that thing of "oh well hold the command button and click the mouse on a mac" that doesn't work at all, i've tried that LOTS of times and it just doesn't work on those... the computers are Imacs all of them are 600mhz connected through WIRES, not wireless (just so you don't claim it might be a problem with interferance)
i've never been badmouthed for using Linux, most people dont even know what that is.
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well that mac problem sounds like bad network administration, but then maybe those macs are hard to administrate?
back to the aside, do any of those 68k emulators run in linux? i would like to try and run a MacOS under linux some time...
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The Official Basilisk II Home Page (http://www.uni-mainz.de/~bauec002/B2Main.html)
[ October 11, 2002: Message edited by: * Red Ranger Software * / Blob ]
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and just to answer my own question, http://www.maconlinux.org/ (http://www.maconlinux.org/) which i saw somebody post in the screenshots thread.
edit - those maconlinux guys seem to only offer versions written for mac versions of linux!! what's the point? you could just dual boot!! i will email them......
[edit - just noticed goseberry's reply, sorry, goose, i basically just spoke shite by saying exactly what you said... :D ]
[ October 11, 2002: Message edited by: Calum ]
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But that only works on Linux/ppc. If you have an x86, use Basilisk (http://www.uni-mainz.de/~bauec002/B2Main.html).
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quote:
Originally posted by Chooco:
i bash macs all the time because they never seem to work properly at school. my school has lots of wintels and maybe 30 macs or so... the macs are fast with excellent graphics BUT half the students' login IDs and passwords don't even work, it has HUGE problems trying to pass through the school's proxy and it always gets errors when starting up where it has the picture of a bomb and the only button you can select is 'restart'
the wintel computers at school don't have those problems, all names and passwords work, they never actually crash (no intensive work like servers or games) and they actually have 2 buttons where you can just right click and select the function you want. despite that thing of "oh well hold the command button and click the mouse on a mac" that doesn't work at all, i've tried that LOTS of times and it just doesn't work on those... the computers are Imacs all of them are 600mhz connected through WIRES, not wireless (just so you don't claim it might be a problem with interferance)
i've never been badmouthed for using Linux, most people dont even know what that is.
Yep, unfortunetly I think Schools are the number 1 reason people get bad impressions of Mac's. Usually they are poorly maintained, and no one takes care of them.
There is allways two aproaches admin's take to the Mac's and they both suck. 1) let the user do whatever the fuck he wants. As a result you get shitloads of INITs and Extensions piled up etc. and the whole thing goes to shit cuz no one is makeing sure the system is properly configured all the time. 2) Lock the sucker up beyond belife. In this situation so many user restrictions are placed on the machine that no one can do anything, no matter how minor.
I used to maintain a Comp. Lab of both NTboxes and iMac's. I was known as "the Mac guy", I'm proud to say that I had all of those iMac's up and running smoothly 100% of the time cuz I made the effort of administrating them properly. Kept the users in their own folders, and at the end of the day gave a quick look at the Extension Manager to put it back it's base set.
Coulden't tell you about the Proxy server issues, prolly on NT (http://tongue.gif)
But seriously, all of these issues are a moot point now adays. You use OSX yet?
EDIT: as for two button mice, just bring your own to the lab. If it's USB, it will work. I personaly still don't see what the big fuss is. I have a big four-button track ball, and the regular old Optical Apple mouse, I switch between them every once in a while. Never actually cared about having more or less buttons, just a diffrent way of working is all.
[ October 11, 2002: Message edited by: psyjax ]
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yeah, dick headed admins can fuck the mac experaince up big time. but my experiances with a g4 400mhz was awsome
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Chooco...
Try Control+click. Cmd+click does absolutely nothing, and it never will.
And why is it that you *need* multiple buttons? Windows wasn't able to use but one button until Windows 95... and people still bitched.
MS's implementation of multiple buttons is about as tactful as bringing Charles Manson to a family event. Sometimes dragging an object moves it... sometimes it copies it... sometimes right dragging will reverse the default action, but sometimes it won't... and other times it will just put a menu up without letting you drag.
As for proxy problems, they did the same shit at my HS. But we had it worse off. We were runnign a mixed bag of ancient ass 030 Performas, a couple of G3 all-in-ones, two G4 towers, and a number of SEs... yes... I graduated in 2000 and we had SEs.
There was one guy in the whole district who knew anything about Apples, and they put him in charge of moving the district to Win2K.
He quit. Now he works for the Univ. of Arkansas.
psy... I've got the same lowly job. but it is fun to debunk windoze lusers' arguments. We're running Jag and it's hilarious to show them how it does things better than expee!