Stop Microsoft
All Things Microsoft => Microsoft as a Company => Topic started by: Refalm on 23 May 2005, 17:04
-
"We purchased a number of Apple G5's because very specific hardware components of the G5 allow developers to emulate some of the technology behind future Xbox products and services," a Microsoft spokesperson said in a statement.
The new console from Microsoft is based on a similar IBM PowerPC architecture used in Apple computers--the Xbox 360 uses three 3.2GHz symmetrical cores, according to the company. Apple has been using PowerPC chips since 1994 and Apple Chief Executive Steve Jobs has said the company is happy with IBM's PowerPC family of chips.
Microsoft recently switched processors from an Intel chip used in the first Xbox console to a custom Xbox processor based on Big Blue's Power technology in its new Xbox 360.
Read more (http://news.com.com/Xbox+360+demos+running+on+Macs/2100-1043_3-5706658.html).
And some people actually believe Macs aren't meant to be gamed on :rolleyes:
-
the Xbox 360 uses three 3.2GHz symmetrical cores
That has got to cost loads!
Jesus.
Unless I'm completely mistaken :confused:
-
I bet the main reson for switching processor type if to stop people installing Linux on it.
-
You can install Linux on the PPC architecture dude. It will only be a matter of time before some geek decides that their new expensive 360 would be better served as a Linux box. I'd be stoked to see someone get OSX installed on it. Imagine that, cheap & powerful macs :)
-
I knew somene would say that.
Not if they keep the processor information secrete and only allow companies access to their compilar tools under a non-disclosure licence.
-
Does anyone have a clue how much it's gonna cost?
-
I knew somene would say that.
Not if they keep the processor information secrete and only allow companies access to their compilar tools under a non-disclosure licence.
How is this possible?
Unless they (MS) are commisioning IBM or Motorola or whoever to create a completely new processor for them, there will have to be engineering documents for other OEM's available. The CPU would be a bloody expensive block of silicon without those!
Now I don't know, or particulaly care, about consoles enough to know if this core will be a completely new design or not but it would be economic stupidity if it is.
EDIT: I just read the thread :)
It seems it will be based on IBM 'Power', I doubt it will be significantly different in fabrication or instruction sets to the current Power (5 is it?). Again, unless MS are throwing huge wedge at IBM there will be no need to extensively modify the already kick-arse processor. I'm aware consoles are loss-leaders but I doubt even Microsoft would see the need to shell out for a clean sheet design CPU, solely to confubjulate any obcessive NetBSD porters :)
PS. If i'm talking crap tell me, you're the EEng dude :)
-
Now I've thought about it a bit more I feel a bit silly, you're right I should've known that. Oh well I'll try to learn to think before I open my big mouth.
-
I think the processors used in the Xbox 360 will be very similar to the current G5, which is based on Power4. The next version of the G5 will probably be based on the Power5 archictecture, but we're still waiting. I also heard the processors used in the next Xbox will also be stripped down versions of the G5 so they can get higher GHz.
Will they be able to run Linux? Sure, this will not be a huge jump from processors already in use, a project will eventually come along to make it run (hey, Linux on the GameBoy DS (http://dslinux.org/) already boots the 2.6 kernel).
-
Theres so much crap, I had to get my waders.
The CPU in the 360 is a custom design based on the Power5 that MS owns. The G5's are the closest commercially available chip on the market right now.
Microsoft make the mistake of licensing the chip designs from Intel and nVidia for the Xbox, and has not made the same mistake again.
-
Oh perhapps I was right first time, I suppose if they're making millions of these things then it would be worth it for them and they could make it bloody hard for people to compile Linux for it.
-
beos could run on this because it can work on PPC archatechture.
it would be too fast.
Mr X
-
stgkshgdrfishgdfsjhdfk;lsajhdfjhsadfh
-
Actually the price should land around 300$. At least that's what I've been told.
Also, I think you can forget installing linux on it because the TCG protection is built in into the CPU instead of a separate chip on the motherboard like on the original XboX. If there still is someone who manages to make some kind of hardware hack I would definately buy one because that would result in a cheap high performing computer.
-
Actually the price should land around 300$. At least that's what I've been told.
Also, I think you can forget installing linux on it because the TCG protection is built in into the CPU instead of a separate chip on the motherboard like on the original XboX. If there still is someone who manages to make some kind of hardware hack I would definately buy one because that would result in a cheap high performing computer.
If it's $300, I'd say it'd do pretty damn well.
Although, even if I could get a chip to make it run GNU/Linux, I would never buy the Xbox 360 because I've sworn to never give MS any of my money again :)
-
Theres so much crap, I had to get my waders.
The CPU in the 360 is a custom design based on the Power5 that MS owns. The G5's are the closest commercially available chip on the market right now.
Microsoft make the mistake of licensing the chip designs from Intel and nVidia for the Xbox, and has not made the same mistake again.
We'll have to suck it and see, but, I think the modifications to POWER5 are going to be insubstantial (in CPU compatibility terms) due to the prohibitive cost and lack of necessity. I feel the biggest stubling block to a porter is more likely to be DRM malarky rather than the CPU.
I hope you don't think that I was implying Microsoft were going to use off-the-shelf G5's... :rolleyes:
Also, are you trying to say that Microsoft own POWER5 or that they own the custom design? They certainly don't own POWER5.
-
If it's $300, I'd say it'd do pretty damn well.
Although, even if I could get a chip to make it run GNU/Linux, I would never buy the Xbox 360 because I've sworn to never give MS any of my money again :)
Well, you can always buy the PS3. Just check the graph below. It totally owns the XboX. Remember that these are individual processors. The XboX uses 3, the PS has 8 (7 in practical use). Though you'll have to wait to spring 2006 for the PS3 to appear on the market. I would gladly buy one because I'm getting pretty bored of ut2004 and doom3 (Cedega won't work).
(http://www.prylguiden.se/content/articles/4/07/08/ps3_chart.jpg)
Damn, check where the x86 (PC) is lying, lol. Is this really such big difference between PPC and x86?
-
Well, you can always buy the PS3. Just check the graph below. It totally owns the XboX. Remember that these are individual processors. The XboX uses 3, the PS has 8 (7 in practical use). Though you'll have to wait to spring 2006 for the PS3 to appear on the market. I would gladly buy one because I'm getting pretty bored of ut2004 and doom3 (Cedega won't work).
(http://www.prylguiden.se/content/articles/4/07/08/ps3_chart.jpg)
Damn, check where the x86 (PC) is lying, lol. Is this really such big difference between PPC and x86?
I'm not really big inta games, but if the PS3 can run GNU/Linux with kb + mouse and networking etc., I might buy one.
-
Sorry for my n00bity, but what does the graph mean?
-
The graph shows the number of floating piont claculations the processor can perform in a second basically it's number crunching capability.
-
And don't forget, IBM is going to have open specifications (http://developers.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=05/05/24/1744205&tid=136&tid=8&tid=10&tid=137) for the Cell processor, so maybe we will have Linux sooner on the PS3 than XBox.
And the Xbox processor will be bassed on the Power5? Come on Apple, bring me my dual-core G6!
-
Hmm... but how does the processor achieve this, having the same frequency (3200MHz)? Is it just more bits at a time, or is there another factor?
-
There are many other factors that deturmine the speed of a processor like cache, bus width ect.
Here are some articles you might find usefull.
Basic definition of Microprocessor (http://www.sharpened.net/glossary/definition.php?microprocessor)
How Microprocessors Work (http://computer.howstuffworks.com/microprocessor1.htm)
-
I'm not really big inta games, but if the PS3 can run GNU/Linux with kb + mouse and networking etc., I might buy one.
Guess It's your lucky day.
Recently Ken Kutaragi had an interview with PC Watch (http://pc.watch.impress.co.jp/), in which he disclosed a few more PS3 details, specifically details surrounding the Cell processor and HDD.
In the interview, Kutaragi states that the PS3 will not ship with an installed HDD, because no matter how large it is, it won't be enough. It would seem, however, that the PS3 will come with a drive bay large enough to support more than one HDD. Kutaragi used an 80gb and 120gb HDD as example, but he also stated that this still wouldn't be enough.
Additionally, Kutaragi further emphasizes that he does not want the PlayStation 3 to be referred to as a toy, or a computer. The PS3 is an entertainment supercomputer. To help get this point across, Kutaragi wants the PS3 HDD to come pre-installed with Linux. Kutaragi also boasts that the PS3's Cell chip will be able to run various PC applications such as video and photo editing software. In fact, he believes that they would run better on the PS3, thanks to the Cell chip's advanced technology.
Of course, with all this great and wonderful technology, time is required to get everything straight. It seems that currently more than 100 PS3 development kits have been distributed by Sony, but they are running out of parts to produce more. This is not the first time Sony has encountered this problem, as dev kits were also in short supply during early PSP development.
I'm getting one for sure. I've also read a lot of tech specs so I'm leaning towards a PS3. I also don't feel like adding money into MS pocket as someone else said. Screw Xbox360!!!:fu: