Stop Microsoft
Operating Systems => Linux and UNIX => Topic started by: anonomouse on 15 August 2005, 20:03
-
Does anyone have any experience with that OS? I am a novice user. I downloaded Vector Linux but its so cluttered I had much trouble figuring things out. Linspire sounds very easy to use since it is supposed to be "like" windows in its operation. Thanx in advance.
PS...
Not very bright with computers;)
-
i know ubuntu is easy to use, not sure about linspire
-
Not to be mean or anything, but if you are not very bright with computers, then perhaps you should stay away from Linux. No matter what anybody says or what kind of advancements there are, Linux is hard. Get a Mac or stick with Windows.
If you really want to use Linux, you are going to have to devote a lot more of your time and effort to studying computers and how they work. In Windows or OSX, you can get away with not reading any manuals or helpfiles, but in Linux, there is serious study and research involved in almost every task. Linux is an operating system designed by computer enthusiasts for computer enthusiasts. If you are not a computer enthusiast, you are going to become frustrated and angry, and you will never get anything done.
Of course, once you pass the learning curve, you will be amazing your friends with your processing power and freedom, and you will be a lord among flies. But you have to want it to get it.
-
Of course, once you pass the learning curve, you will be amazing your friends with your processing power and freedom, and you will be a lord among flies. But you have to want it to get it.
And that's the best part of Linux, for me at least. ;)
I've used Linspire before, and I really didn't like it AT ALL.
Slackware 10.1 is great though, although I wouldn't recommend using it as your first flavour of Linux.
I started off on Redhat 9, which was brilliant, even if a bit dated. :)
-
Here's (http://) some useful UNIX ebooks.
EDIT:
Sorry, Link removed.
-
I have used it on live CD, it's alright. I'll upload it to you if you want. Just gotta remake a .iso of it from the live CD since I dunno what I did with the original. It's the official Linspire 5-0 Live CD that they where giving away for free on bittorrent from they're site a few months back.
-
Good to see you Duo Maxwell.:)
What hapend to Microsucks?
Why did you close it?
Was it competition from this site? :D
-
Social experiment gone bad. perhaps in the future it will be reopened and James will have his Root acount back.
-
social experiment? Is that what you call a good forum, where you never posted anything or ever bothered to become an active member? Except when you decided to trash it?
-
I don't think Linspire is a good starting point for a new Linux user. :thumbdwn:
I mean, I started off on Redhat 9, without knowing ANYTHING about Linux at all, I managed to learn a few commands and then I was away. :)
-
From my limited knowledge I think Linspire 5.0 would be great for a homework level machine for a novice user as thats its target market. Its designed to do the basics well.
You should be able to get a trial CNR account and download all the software you need which should all install easily.
If you just need it to do stuff like that then its perfect. It won't do many games though.
If I was buying a PC for my grandparents I would install that on it, I think its probably easier to learn than windows because Linux hides things better from the user and isn't full of crap all over the place.
-
I still wouldn't say Linspire is a good starting point for a new Linux user.
If you learn a few commands, you'll figure things out pretty easily, that's how I got started. :)
I still only know very few commands, but I can do exactly what I want in Linux. ;)
-
After using Ubuntu, I no longer want new Linux users, or an easy Linux. I hate things Easy, it just means more gets fucked up.
If your a man get Slackware, Debian, or at least Fedora. If your a fucking piss weak white trash motherfucker with a heroin addiction, use Linspire, Ubuntu, Mandriva, etc.
-
After using Ubuntu, I no longer want new Linux users, or an easy Linux. I hate things Easy, it just means more gets fucked up.
If your a man get Slackware, Debian, or at least Fedora. If your a fucking piss weak white trash motherfucker with a heroin addiction, use Linspire, Ubuntu, Mandriva, etc.
Agreed.
We need no more IT-handicapped plug-n-pray degenerates into our scene. We need skilled people, like solo and hi's Komodo team, to make some new revolutionary GNU/Linux applications.
-
Yeah, Linux is for hackers, not jack-arses.
-
After using Ubuntu, I no longer want new Linux users, or an easy Linux. I hate things Easy, it just means more gets fucked up.
If your a man get Slackware, Debian, or at least Fedora. If your a fucking piss weak white trash motherfucker with a heroin addiction, use Linspire, Ubuntu, Mandriva, etc.
I completely agree with you Kintaro, I use Slackware Linux, I started out on Redhat 9 and all the other shite I have used (Mandrake & SuSE).
I think Mandriva & SuSE should be binned. ;)
-
Yeah, I might campaign Stallman to put a clause in the GPL 3 so they can ban certain distributors.
-
That's a very good idea, I support that. :)
-
Good to see someone has a brain.
-
Yeah, I've used Ubuntu, it's disgusting. *Shudders*
-
I completely disagree with the three of you.
GNU/Linux is a fully functional operating system, and it is much better than any flavour of Windows. If so, then why not make it accessible to everyone? One of the pleasant things about GNU/Linux is the community. The community that happily helps anyone set up their GNU/Linux machines and fix their problems themselves. The more people use GNU/Linux, the stronger the community. The result: more commercial activity, more Free activity, more, better software = better for all of us. The final, hypothetic result: Either the destruction of MS, or the increase in quality and/or decrease in price of proprietary SW = better for all of us, and all of them.
What is breaking the community? YOU! People who make people change their minds, thank you very much. PLEASE keep to your geeky selves and let US grow! Let us gain POWER! You will benefit.
-
I agree with Jenda.
I don't have a problem with Ubuntu but Linspire is shit as it's proprietary software in GLP clothing. I personally still don't think Linux is 100% newb friendly as you'll always have to edit some txt file like fstab or the bootloader configuration file at some stage (well at least with most of the distros I've used). Come on, prove me wrong by suggesting a pure point and click distro where the only use for the keyboard is entering passwords, using the Internet and wordprocessing?
-
I think they might have been joking.
-
*reads thread from the beginning"
Of course Jimmy - I feel a right dipshit now. ;)
-
Try Damn Small Linux its very cool and will only take 3hrs + a CD (10 min if you don't have a dialup modem)
-
I think they might have been joking.
Indeed...
-
I completely disagree with the three of you.
GNU/Linux is a fully functional operating system, and it is much better than any flavour of Windows.
Ever tried Windows Server 2003?
Just askin' ...
If so, then why not make it accessible to everyone? One of the pleasant things about GNU/Linux is the community. The community that happily helps anyone set up their GNU/Linux machines and fix their problems themselves. The more people use GNU/Linux, the stronger the community. The result: more commercial activity, more Free activity, more, better software = better for all of us. The final, hypothetic result: Either the destruction of MS, or the increase in quality and/or decrease in price of proprietary SW = better for all of us, and all of them.
Making Linux accessible to everyone SHOULD NOT BE THE FIRST PRIORITY!
We should first design good standards for application binary distribution. This would mean that base-system should be totally eradicated from the installed apps, instead of integrating them under /usr and such ...
Cool looking GUI is nothing. Techical superiority is everything. Obey your brains instead your eyes, or you are a fucking lamer.
Ok I admit that people like end-user-wimps care not how things work, if they just work. But have you ever tried to find software packages from internet, and just install them on yer linsux box? Does not work, since binary distribution is fucking hard, because GNU/Linux systems are chaotic pieces of shit. This means one gotta trust their distro-spesific software repository, and hope all their software can be found from there ... unless they are smart enough to compile their stuff themselves, which most linsux lusers are not ;)
What is breaking the community? YOU! People who make people change their minds, thank you very much. PLEASE keep to your geeky selves and let US grow! Let us gain POWER! You will benefit.
I won't benefit anything from users who just Use Linux and be content with it. I only benefit from users who are UNSATISFIED, and want to make something new and revolutionary (like the LSB-people and the dudes who make the Komodo -runtime platform).
If people just install Linux to play around with it, and think they are "elite", they are actually doing harm to the entire community. GNU/Linux is too immature to tolerate non-idealists and flegmatic desktop users.
Am I an elitist? Certainly.
Am I a good coder? HELL NO, but I have a lot of ideas and opinions (some of them under development)
Do I really need GNU/Linux spesifically? No, i could do just fine with Windows. I only use GNU/Linux, because I have the power to create, the power to decide for my system.
People who do not really care what they use and why should stick with their Windows (warezzed or legal). Only if you are ready to commit for the development of the entire scene should you use GNU/Linux. Period.
-
In conclusion: on GNU/Linux, it is very hard to distribute in binary form, a package that will work on all or most GNU/Linux systems. Therefore GNU/Linux is a piece of shit.
Yea fucking right.
-
Even GNU/Linux needs the masses. They (or should I say we?) are useful in many ways, including: beta testing & bug reports, financial support via purchase, support in spreading the word (which increases the number of people working). The masses showed important in beating the Software Patent Law in the EU, because without them, it might've passed. Umm... I'm kind of out of words for now, but I'll be back later.
-
In conclusion: on GNU/Linux, it is very hard to distribute in binary form, a package that will work on all or most GNU/Linux systems. Therefore GNU/Linux is a piece of shit.
Yea fucking right.
Precisely.
(did i spell that word correctly?)
-
Precisely.
(did i spell that word correctly?)
Indeed, you're becoming very proficient at spelling...
The fact that it's not easy to distribute in binary form for Linux is a nuissance, and should be worked upon - it probably is. This doesn't justify your hard wording.
Linux NEEDS standardisation, most of us will, I think agree, but the fact remains that ultra-orthodox-one-mold-one-prog standards as in MS-W did not prove to be most efficient, or secure.
-
Indeed, you're becoming very proficient at spelling...
The fact that it's not easy to distribute in binary form for Linux is a nuissance, and should be worked upon - it probably is. This doesn't justify your hard wording.
Linux NEEDS standardisation, most of us will, I think agree, but the fact remains that ultra-orthodox-one-mold-one-prog standards as in MS-W did not prove to be most efficient, or secure.
Yay, im catching up some language here ... this trolling not so useless after all =)
Total dictatorship over the userland is not a good idea, like in Windows, since it introduces a lot of security problems ...
I think all GNU/Linux needs are good ABI standards.
NOT centralized userland/ABI, but STANDARDS. All conforming OS's could then implement these standards in their own way, but stay compatible. The Komodo -runtime is a good start for such. Another good standard is the LSB (Linux Standard Base), which actually defines the low-level ABI and it's functionality. I personally see the LSB as an extension for POSIX.
The problem is, that most opensource coders are too arrogant or "ethical" (or more spesifically, they lie to themselves) to adhere to such standards. Most GNU/Linux developers piss on LSB, and call it "a nazi standard for the enterprise" ... and since the Mono (and so Komodo -runtime) are based upon a back-ported enterprise application (MS .NET framework), will most hippiecommie coder bastards frown upon it too ... and this is so sad :(
Luckily, I've been developing a native-binary distribution framework called Exo-Runtime, which tries to compile POSIX compliant software into a sandboxed (and so partially managed) form ... tho I've been mocked for trying such.
I think that the OSS scene consist of three kinds of people:
1) The people who are really into the ethics of Open Source and Free Software. They diss at everything that is not GPL. Unfortunately these idealists are also the most talented coders, but they refuse to follow any enterprise driven standards ... making eg. binary distribution hard when using their software components.
2) The wannabe-gurus who just hang in the scene, and be content with everything the GPL license provides them, eg. end users who just use the GNU/Linux scene as an excuse to show-off and diss at other people. They REALLY DO NOT CARE about how GNU/Linux systems work, or what they could be made to be.
3) The rare, perceptive and innovatice coders/developers, who really understand that GPL and closed-source MUST and CAN be united in a practical way. Most BSD people are like these, and the people who develop the Mono runtime and the LSB standards. They get the most flames and blames, but must tolerate it ...
The GNU/linux scene is full of blind and intolerant (or fake-intolerant wannabe) people. This does not help GNU/Linux at all in the enterprise.
Personally, I am an elitist. But rather than jerking over some spesific distro/Desktop-environtment/application, I see all the problems GNU/Linux has, and try to make people share my thoughts. People want to get into enterprise with their linsux boxes? This is what I want too, but the scene is so fucking decadent and flegmatic, that nothing is gonna happen for a long time ...
-
The thing is some programmers want to use Qt while others use Gtk and then some more want to write their own because they think both suck.
-
Most GNU/Linux developers piss on LSB, and call it "a nazi standard for the enterprise" ... and since the Mono (and so Komodo -runtime) are based upon a back-ported enterprise application (MS .NET framework), will most hippiecommie coder bastards frown upon it too ... and this is so sad :(
Where has this happened?
Luckily, I've been developing a native-binary distribution framework called Exo-Runtime, which tries to compile POSIX compliant software into a sandboxed (and so partially managed) form
Glad to see your trying to fix what you see as problems with most GNU/Linux systems.
... tho I've been mocked for trying such.
Where?
1) The people who are really into the ethics of Open Source and Free Software. They diss at everything that is not GPL.
That, is bullshit. GPL is not synonymous with free software or open source, it's one free-software licence out of lots. And now, I can't figure out if you mean that we diss everything not GPL (wrong) or we diss everything non-free (correct).
Unfortunately these idealists are also the most talented coders
I dunno if that's true - take a look at Linus Torvalds.
but they refuse to follow any enterprise driven standards
Perhaps because there's less need whenever they're going to be distributing their packages in source-form?
... making eg. binary distribution hard when using their software components.
They'll most likely not be distributing anything in binary form and therfore don't need to follow "enterprise driven standards".
3) The rare, perceptive and innovatice coders/developers, who really understand that GPL and closed-source MUST and CAN be united in a practical way. Most BSD people are like these, and the people who develop the Mono runtime and the LSB standards. They get the most flames and blames, but must tolerate it ...
Where? I've never seen any of this happen...
The GNU/linux scene is full of blind and intolerant (or fake-intolerant wannabe) people.
Maybe you're one of them. You're not seeing the fact that some of the stuff you never shut up about isn't all that important to most people by far.
Personally, I am an elitist. But rather than jerking over some spesific distro/Desktop-environtment/application, I see all the problems GNU/Linux has, and try to make people share my thoughts. People want to get into enterprise with their linsux boxes? This is what I want too, but the scene is so fucking decadent and flegmatic, that nothing is gonna happen for a long time ...
So that's why GNU/Linux isn't likely to ever make it!
I think not.
-
Perhaps because there's less need whenever they're going to be distributing their packages in source-form?
Yes. This is what makes them blind ... they need to see, that enterprise NEEDS stable ABI's. A stable API means nothing in the long run, unless most of the software using it are OpenSource, and can be distributed in source form.
And about this mocking, oh it is so true. I am not talking about these forums, but in the IRC I get mocked because my ideas are considered "too radical" or something. When I suggest people that they should embrace LSB in their software development, they either ignore me, state that "LSB is useless crap/nazi standard/whatever" or they just tell me to stfu.
This happens at least in those finnish channels i sometimes chat in ...
Okay, people don't often mock me, but most of em ignore my ideas, or tell me to shut up. They won't even give me any constructive criticism. So I think it's "ksym versus the world" ...
Luckily I am free to develop my ideas. We'll see if they are any good, or if I just should delete all my shit ..
-
The thing is some programmers want to use Qt while others use Gtk and then some more want to write their own because they think both suck.
Yeah, I think you are right. In proprietary world the manufacturer can enforce standards and ABI's as they wish, since they got the code ...
Evolution should take place faster, and those rare-used software components should just vanish ...
-
Yeah, I think you are right. In proprietary world the manufacturer can enforce standards and ABI's as they wish, since they got the code ...
Evolution should take place faster, and those rare-used software components should just vanish ...
Yeah, but in the propritary world it has been a problem as well, DLL-Hell for example. Their have been clever attempts to rid this ineffiency from both systems however it is always a problem. However in Linux I feel their will always be a bit of fragmentation regarding the different libaries that do similar things that people use.