Down with XP!

[psyjax]

quote:Originally posted by Ctrl Alt Del 123:
No it's NOT true that WMP sends info back to MS about what you watch/play. I have ZA on and WMP NEVER connects to the internet unless I watch a streaming video.

Try a dedicated conection. Like a T1 or DSL and check what packets are being sent out, then youll know for sure.

I have heard people on this forum test this and they report that WMP does send info. out if conected online. M$ has also admited that WMP collects data on what the user watches or listesn to. They say they are not using it for advertising or anything but they don't say they won't.

[Master of Reality]

and what the hell is winamp trying to access the internet for when i play shit?

[psyjax]

Wow! Druaga and I posted at nearly the same time saying nearly the same thing   .

Jinx!

[Master of Reality]

quote:Originally posted by psyjax:
Wow! Druaga and I posted at nearly the same time saying nearly the same thing    .

Jinx!

it could be because we both live here. (i sleep behind the linux forum)

[Brent]

Might sound to you like a stupid question but what guarentee is there that some brilliant open source programmer contributing to linux isnt imbedding some kind of wierd shit in his/her programs?  being open source, I doubt if there is any control over that.  I read that article and there are some very good points in it from a business point of view.  I dont like Microsofts
business practices any more than any of you, but most companys are not interested in experimenting, they want proven systems that contribute to the bottom line.  You would have to admit that the layoffs at Red Hat and others are a bit of a concern.  Much as I dislike them, if I owned a large corporation, I would have to go with microsoft.

[Calum]

alright, a valid question, from a day to day point of view, and the answer is as follows.

Open source means that you can read through all the code yrself.
If you can understand the code, then you can see exactly what the software is programmed to do.
M$ software is usually (always?) NOT open source, so you can't tell what it does. All GPL software IS open source, so you CAN see what it does.

"Oh no!" i can hear the world screaming," I can't understand all this meaningless computer geek gibberish! i am going to fall prey to the unscrupulous code writers of the world!"
well i say ploppypoos to that, because enough people use linux that do understand every character of code, that if some open source thing turned up with malicious code in it, everybody would know about it very soon.

While some people might not spread it around, there are enough loudmouthed altruists in the linux community that it's unrealistic that any GPL software could be spyware without you knowing about it.

Not all linux software is GPL, and some software even admits/advertises that it's spyware. (i'm thinking of KazAa for windows here actually but there's bound to be similar licences for some unix programs) and you have to allow it to be if you want to use it.

That's it in a nutshell. pretty good compared to the alternative where you have to first believe that a company who will go unnamed have no spyware in their OS or programs, then later when they admit they were LYING (yes this has happened before) you have to trust the liars when they say that they won't use the information they have already gathered and are already gathering about you for illicit purposes or commercial gain.
Would their word stand up in a court of law? (of course it would, haven't you heard of backhanders?)

I know that some people who post here don't like to view M$ pages so i'm going to quote some of the contents of the pages that are linked to above, so you don't have to go to M$ to read them:  

quote:How Does Linux Compare? Competitive Comparisons
Read about the strengths of Small Business Server compared with this competitor.

Thousands of Compatible Applications
Because Small Business Server 2000 includes the mature, multipurpose Microsoft Windows

[Brent]

Perhaps this is a simplistic way of looking at it but I believe Microsoft will fall, but it will be of their own doing.  Nothing directly related to the open source community as it exists now.
Probably, many of you were not around when Ford, General Motors dominated the Auto industry. When the first Datsuns, toyotas and volkswagons first went on the market in North America, they were anything but a great success.  What did the Japanese do?  They did everything Ford and GM did only in many instances, better and cheaper.  They didnt attempt to destroy Ford or GM, they simply tried (and in some ways succeeded) to beat them at their own game..Throughout the history of the free world, any corporation that attempted total domination has eventually collapsed for too many reasons to even begin to list here.
I think its enough to say...give it time. Linux is not going to be a Microsoft replacement, nor should it be.  Its a totally different concept. I would suspect that a replacement will end up being another closed source system, simply because of the control factor. You do have to admit, control is not a concept that most that are involved with open source want or like.

[jtpenrod]

quote: Probably, many of you were not around when Ford, General Motors dominated the Auto industry. When the first Datsuns, toyotas and volkswagons first went on the market in North America, they were anything but a great success

The comparison between GM and M$ is more apropos than that. GM's downfall was due to their arrogance. If that brand-new Chevy turned out to be a lemon, getting any satisfaction from your friendly GM dealership was next to impossible. What did they care? If you didn't like it, you could just take the bus or walk, that was the attitude      They did nothing to ensure quality, the mechanics were lousey, the dealers uncooperative. They ended up driving people to Toyota, Datsun, etc. one customer at a time.

M$ is doing the same thing with WPA, treating the valued customer like a potential criminal. The product is shoddy and getting worse. After all, XP was suppose to be the most secure Windows ever, and yet it has as many holes and exploits as any previous iteration. Now they have this "Trustworthy Computing" initiative - Mr. Goodwrench for the new milennium.     (I really like that: trustworthy computing from an untrustworthy company) More form devoid of substance. M$ is following GM down the same road to self-destruction.    
________________________________

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[ April 01, 2002: Message edited by: jtpenrod ]

[Calum]

quote:Originally posted by average user:
Perhaps this is a simplistic way of looking at it but I believe Microsoft will fall, but it will be of their own doing.  Nothing directly related to the open source community as it exists now.
Probably, many of you were not around when Ford, General Motors dominated the Auto industry. When the first Datsuns, toyotas and volkswagons first went on the market in North America, they were anything but a great success.  What did the Japanese do?  They did everything Ford and GM did only in many instances, better and cheaper.  They didnt attempt to destroy Ford or GM, they simply tried (and in some ways succeeded) to beat them at their own game..Throughout the history of the free world, any corporation that attempted total domination has eventually collapsed for too many reasons to even begin to list here.
I think its enough to say...give it time. Linux is not going to be a Microsoft replacement, nor should it be.  Its a totally different concept. I would suspect that a replacement will end up being another closed source system, simply because of the control factor. You do have to admit, control is not a concept that most that are involved with open source want or like.

Averageuser and jptenrod, you have both hit the nail right on the thumb.

This is exactly what will happen. M$ will alienate evrybody until one day they will wake up and realise they have no friends. Actually they may have a messy period of kicking and screaming before that.
there will probably be a brief scuffle between Sun microsystems and Apple computer, with Apple taking the apparent backseat quite quickly (actually sun and apple will just carve the industry in two to avoid stepping on each other's toes) and before you know it, M$ is a third rate player with a fourth rate OS.

Linux doesn't figure in this story. Why?
because it is a hobbyists' OS. hobbyists use it for their hobbies. The fact is some of them choose not to get a commercial OS, but they may have chosen not to do that even if they didn't have linux as a hobby.
In real life linux is getting used more and more in businesses, homes and for servers, and this will have its commercial effect, but linux is not a company, there's not (really) any controlling interest, and it can't go out of business, because it was never in business to start with. linux does not compete with any other OS. in a very real sense the people who choose linux over any other commercial product are themselves the instruments of change. linux itself is just a piece of software for hobbyists.

It's a very quiet revolution, but yr right, it will happen inexorably in our lifetimes.

[Calum]

quote:Originally posted by Bateleur:
The MP3 ENcoders are not supposed to be free. Fraunhofer owns the patents and charges royalties. The players are free though.

Ogg Vorbis is a dang fine audio codec, IMO, and I looking forward to Ogg Tarkin.    

I seriously doubt WinXP will be pulled off the shelves. Its not worth the headache to government, MS, or the customers.

Here's my favourite MP3 encoder's website

This is software for windows which includes at least one mp3 encoder and i think a windows media audio encoder and an ogg vorbis one too. It supports a whole bunch more so long as you can get the encoders, you can easily use them as plugins. There are no limits on any of the functionality of any of the encoders.
I have it set up in windows with both bladeenc and lame.
This program and any additional encoders i have installed with it were all free to download and i saw no mention that i would have to pay for a licence.

This is the page for the equivalent program in linux.
This is a frontend for cdparanoia and whatever encoders you may have downloaded.
Unlike the one above, this one requires you to get cdparanoia (the ripper) and any encoders yourself. I got bladeenc and will soon be looking for lame and gogo.
because it's cdparanoia, this program is a lot more thorough and stable than its windows counterpart, but slower, which to me is an acceptable trade.

My point is that so far i have had no trouble getting any of these programs and/or libraries/plugins for free. So far as i know i have not had to break any laws at all yet, so them Frauenhoffers must be really lax about protecting their patents! either that or they are too preoccupied with something else to care! who knows?...

[voidmain]

quote:Originally posted by Calum:

Linux doesn't figure in this story. Why?
because it is a hobbyists' OS. hobbyists use it for their hobbies. The fact is some of them choose not to get a commercial OS, but they may have chosen not to do that even if they didn't have linux as a hobby.
In real life linux is getting used more and more in businesses, homes and for servers, and this will have its commercial effect, but linux is not a company, there's not (really) any controlling interest, and it can't go out of business, because it was never in business to start with. linux does not compete with any other OS. in a very real sense the people who choose linux over any other commercial product are themselves the instruments of change. linux itself is just a piece of software for hobbyists.

I don't really agree with this. Apple would probably pick up the bulk of the desktop but Linux would replace Windows on servers before Sun does. Sun will keep the servers it already has but on the Lower end servers that Windows runs on Linux would easily replace it.  I am have no discrimination when it comes to replacing an OS with Linux. I replace just as many Sun servers as I do Windows servers. Two more down just today.

[Calum]

hooray! onward the revolution!
i have had limited experience with sun's stuff (a few months with a company database running on SunOS5) but it looks like their politics may echo M$ on a more sedate sensible level.
Actually i reckon that linux will be very widespread, but because it's not a company, it'll never have a market share, it'll just eliminate the market share of real companies.
As far as servers are concerned, there is no reason that i can see why linux would not always be the best choice of OS. but, once the server revolution is firmly in place (as it is) linux will need to make an effort to become a workstation OS quick before it gets pigeonholed as a server only thing. i reckon we might see a backlash of people who used linux when it was unstable (like now for example!) as a desktop OS and compared it with windows (remember that these people have been using windows for a while and can sidestep many of its 'issues' without even knowing they're doing it) unfavourably.
If too many people get the idea that linux is only for top end users (which to an extent it is, desktopwise), and Apple computer make an OS that requires new and expensive hardware to run, the way is open for Sun MicroSystems to ruch in there and whip the market away. They haven't had the publicity so far that linux has had, but they are a company, and this means that if they get their act together, they could probably outmaneuvre linux in the publicity arena.
I don't know, we'll see, but in 10 years time, maybe i'll bump into you on the fucksunOS.com forums!!

[vasper]

>Thousands of Compatible Applications
Mostly Microsoft made and BloatWare!
Thousands smaller are freely available on the Net for almost every flavour of *nix and doing the same job with a smaller footprint, 5 times faster and on inferior hardware.

>Better Integration and Ease of Use

[Ctrl Alt Del 123]

About WMP, by default (and default = crap) WMP WILL CONNECT TO THE NET, go Tools > Options and turn off anything that looks like WMP will connect to the internet.

I'll repeat myself, WMP doesn't connect to the internet, ZA is set to Max security and has WMP set to ASK if it is allowed to connect to the net, and it doesn't.

[Macman]

Wow, reading your comments I realized something, if M$ goes under, Linux will explode (in a good way).